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Why
Lead Developer
04 Jul 2009

Location: Utrecht

3-3-12 edited to remove the term Hortator

Since our first Redoran NPC claim is coming up, I figured now would be the perfect time to post a bit about the House so that we're all on the same wavelength.

Redoran Identity
To start, I'd like to remind you all of The True Noble's Code, the Redoran faction book in vanilla. It's a good document, and you should read it. It mentions that the House observes the triune virtues of duty, gravity, and piety. Relevant quotes, and further explanations and expansion, below.
    Duty
    "A Redoran's duty is first to the Tribunal Temple, second to the Great House Redoran, and third to one's family and clan. In the Battle of Red Mountain, warriors of House Redoran died bravely for their duty to the Tribunal. By defending House Redoran from the schemes of Telvanni wizards and the lies of untrustworthy Hlaalu, the true noble shows duty to House Redoran. Following the Temple's guidelines of mercy and generosity show duty to one's family and clan."
    A true Redoran serves both Almsivi (and by extension, the Dunmer people), their own House, and their own Clan. To fail one is to fail the others. The distinction between House and Clan is especially important - House Redoran consists of many different families, each with their own ancestry, identity and often times clanstead. Among Redoran, a noble represents his Clan, and among Dunmer, he represents his House. Your actions reflect on your family's status within House Redoran.

    Gravity
    "A Redoran noble must know the virtue of gravity. It is not the Redoran way to laugh at serious matters, for it shows disrespect. It is not the Redoran way to spread rumors, for they fester and breed dissent."
    This one is pretty self-explanatory. Redoran is led by family patriarchs, mostly elders, and those people are typically above petty frivolities. They're direct and serious and old enough to care about their Clan and House rather than their individual interests, and they are role models for younger Redoran, so this elderly gravity extends to the newer generations too.

    Piety
    "A Redoran must show piety to the Aedra and Daedra, our creators and ancestors. For without the divine, we would not have the chance to serve. And without divine law, we would not know right from wrong. And without giving thanks for these things, we would forget out place and our purpose."
    Yes, the Redoran are a religious bunch. There's more to it than just serving the Temple though. Their "place and purpose" again refers to their identity as the Defenders of the People. They identify with Vivec, to quote Adanorcil: "When there is a seemingly insurmountable obstacle or a great danger to the people, they, like Vivec, will go out and make sure it gets solved. In this sense, they have a rather romantic idea of themselves as the house of heroes."
The Redoran have a great sense of individuality. They're not organized like the Indoril, instead individual Redoran aspire to enact these virtues as best they can, and in doing so they fulfill their purpose. This should be reflected in their House's structure - individual family members hone their warrior skills, individual families and communities take care of their own affairs, and only if something is too large for a single Redoran, or a single Clan, it becomes a House affair.

House structure
Because of the above, House Redoran is structured way more organically than many of the other Houses. House Redoran lacks a unified Council like the other Houses have. Instead, elders, hetmen (hetmans? hetmer?) and family patriarchs lead local communities. When decisions of regional importance need to be made, these individuals come together. These meetings used to be initiated by an Elder or House Father who invited local respected Redoran. Over time some of these incidental gatherings gained some measure of permanence, and evolved into what are currently known as the Councils of Baan Malur, Kogotel and Kartur. These councils have no official leaders and still consist of nobles and representatives from near these cities. In gameplay terms, these individuals are the House Fathers.

That does not mean House Redoran has nobody to lead them. In times of crisis, when the need for a unified response to a threat arises, Redoran's great heroes and the patriarchs of the most influential families gather at Skar and select one of their number to be their Archmaster, their war leader. Archmaster is a title for life. In gameplay terms, anyone who would show up at such a meeting is a Councilman. These days, Councilors are generally selected by their local councils to act as representatives, bar a few possible exceptions.

Recent history
The current Archmaster is Bolvyn Venim, appointed during the Arnesian War. Once the war was over, Venim led the House towards Red Mountain, believing it was Redoran's duty to be the first line of defense against the rising threat of Dagoth Ur. Some of Redoran's House Fathers and heroes, including Athyn Sarethi, one of Redoran's greatest warriors, responded to Venim's call to action and followed him to the Vvardenfell territories where they claimed the surrounding land as their own. Because many of these nobles did not have any prior holdings on Vvardenfell, they took up residence within Skar. Together with Remas Movaryn, the Lord of Maar Gan who lived in Ald'ruhn prior to Venim's arrival, and Hlaren Ramoran of Gnisis, who also moved to Skar, this group of noble mer formed the new Redoran Council of Ald'ruhn.

The move should be seen as of symbolical rather than practical significance. While it is still the official heart of Redoran decision-making, because of Skar's new role as the home of the Ald'ruhn Council, the distance between Ald'ruhn and the mainland, and a general lack of external threats to the people of Morrowind besides Dagoth Ur, no House Council meetings have been held since the end of the Arnesian War. The Councils of Baan Malur, Kogotel and Kartur continue to function as before.

While Dagoth Ur and the Sixth House are still a major threat, they work underground which makes them difficult to combat. Furthermore, the Temple has forbidden any large scale expeditions inside the Ghostfence, seeking instead to contain Dagoth Ur. As a result of this, Venim is feeling more useless and frustrated by the day as his honor as Archmaster forces him to sit and wait in Ald'ruhn. Rather than letting them sit on their hands in the Ashlands awaiting clearance from the Temple, Venim has sent back many of his War Parties to their respective Clansteads.

Back in Velothis district, Redoran has fallen into a state of slight disorganization. Communication and coordination between the three other councils is slow. The Council of Kartur has so far been unable to come up with an answer to Hlaalu expansionism in the south. Similarly, unrest is brewing in the Uld Vraech to the north, an area with a large population of native Nords who have long felt oppressed by the Dunmer. The Baan Malur council, acting on Gargen Huul's repeated warnings, is keeping a close eye on the situation.

Which leaves us at...
...where we are now. In terms of building a storyline, Redoran vs Hlaalu only has so much potential. Redoran and Hlaalu aren't enemies, Hlaalu is simply taking advantage of Redoran's weakness, as one expects they would. Besides, Hlaalu is already on track to collide head-on with Indoril over their differences, religious issues and Thirr trade. We can have some quests about the Hlaalu, but building a giant story arc around it is not a good idea.

On the other hand, the Uld Vraech has some amazing potential for Redoran's endgame. The situation is already tense, but Baan Malur council is handling it as best they can. Obviously at this point the player would be familiar with the situation in the Uld Vraech as we'd have sent them there on a couple of quests. Imagine for a moment a Nord warlord returning to his native Uld Vraech after amassing a band of warriors in Skyrim, and rallying the local Nords to form an army to liberate their homeland from the Dunmer oppressors. After the player has been running around doing whatever quests a Redoran hireling does to work their way to membership of a local council (preferably Kartur), this army crosses Dunmereth Pass and moves to Strond, the local Nords start a revolt, Dunmer are chased out of Nordic villages, several Dunmeri villages (Mandul, Shneif) are pillaged and/or liberated. Eventually it falls to the player to solve the situation.

This is just a general overview - the later questline will be developed more fully later on. For now, these are the themes you should work with when NPCing Redoran. Any questions, additions or suggestions can go in this thread. I'll add a bit about their relationships with other factions later.

_________________
Oh, how rarely wisdom rules our hearts!


Last edited by Why on Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:20 am; edited 2 times in total
Post Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:29 am Send private message       Send e-mail       Reply with quote                   up  
Matin Sanguine
Developer
22 Aug 2012

Location: Australia

I like the approach that your taking to this Why, House Redoran (by my interpretation of your post) is more a group of individuals that are loosely united by a common set of principles/ideals that they strive to follow, and thus lack any rigid, over-arching command structure. This would be both a blessing and a curse for House Redoran as it would allow for greater flexibility and power for local authorities and councils to deal with issues and would better acquainted with the issues in their certain area, to the extent that they would be able to tackle them effectively. Also they would be able to react to an unexpected situation with far more speed then a more regimented command structure would allow. This would also work against them as it would be far more difficult to have the individualistic Redoran work together on a consistent basis, along with being unable to present a harmonious unified front due to the nature of their (unclear and individualistic) command structure. This last aspect could seriously hamper unified House Redoran efforts to act on issues that concern and require the resources of the whole house.

I also like the idea of concentrating on the Nord conflict for House Redoran endgame instead of purely making it a House vs House conflict, it's an extremely interesting idea and certainly would feel very unique as a questline.

The title is Hetman by the way (example, Hetman Abelmawia), though I am not entirely certain what the plural form is, but it may be either Hetmen or Hetmans (embarrassingly I have no idea on this).

I do have several questions however:

1. Could you go into greater detail on the exact organizational structure of a Council? In particular could you elaborate on these lines:

Why wrote:
That does not mean House Redoran has nobody to lead them. In times of crisis, when the need for a unified response to a threat arises, Redoran's great heroes and the patriarchs of the most influential families gather at Skar and select one of their number to be their Hortator, their war leader. Hortator is a title for life. In gameplay terms, anyone who would show up at such a meeting is a Councilman. These days, Councilors are generally selected by their local councils to act as representatives, bar a few possible exceptions. The leader of such a council would be the Archmaster.


I am a little confused by the role the Councilors and the Archmaster plays in this, as well as the make up of the Councils in general.

2.
Why wrote:
Venim led the House towards Red Mountain, believing it was Redoran's duty to be the first line of defense against the rising threat of Dagoth Ur.


I had always assumed whilst playing Morrowind that one of the major reasons for Venim relocating to Vvardenfell was to get a leg up on the expansion efforts. While I do not contest that a feeling of duty to defeating Dagoth Ur would have factored into his decision, I do ask however whether or not my assumption has any merit.

3.
Why wrote:
Because many of these nobles did not have any prior holdings on Vvardenfell, they took up residence within Skar. Together with Remas Movaryn, the Lord of Maar Gan who lived in Ald'ruhn prior to Venim's arrival, and Hlaren Ramoran of Gnisis, who also moved to Skar, this group of noble mer formed the new Redoran Council of Ald'ruhn.


So if Hlaren Ramoran lived in Vvardenfell (Gnisis to be more specific) originally, why did he then move to Skar? Is it part of the rules that members of a Council must live at the location of their respective Council? or are they given accommodation at the location of the Council and have the option to continue living at their own estate? The latter would make more sense to me (considering Bal Isra, the estate given to the player), but I would like it cleared up nonetheless.

4. Have you made a decision on whether or not you would add the option for players to join the Nord's side in the conflict at Uld Vraech? I understand if you haven't made up your mind as it isn't particularly pressing or important.

And congratulation on getting your Redoran piece completed Why, and sorry if I missed something in your post that answered one or more of my questions.

_________________
"SLOAD. SOAP. IS. NOT. SOAP"- TF

"As to where the ash comes from.. fuck if I care." -Sload
Post Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:00 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Why
Lead Developer
04 Jul 2009

Location: Utrecht

1: there are four local councils. The ones of Kartur, Kogotel and Baan Malur are ancient and well established, and made up of local elders, patriarchs, and/or other community pillars. Basically representatives from rural areas and the cities themselves. House Fathers. They're there because they care. I think our current plans for Bodrem include a mine owner who acts as the town elder, he provides work to the villagers and advises those in need. He'd be the kind of guy that would represent the village at Kartur Council.

The Ald'ruhn Council is a bit different, since it's made up mostly by the nobles (think of nobles not in terms of riches or land, but honor and status) who followed Venim to Vvardenfell. It functions basically the same though. More on it later.

Now, the House Council, for lack of a better term. I called this War Council in an earlier draft. Redoran may be a bit scattered and isolated, but word does get around when something bad happens in Morrowind. During such times the heroes of the House gather at Skar to decide on a course if action. These meetings evolve organically and happen as a result of the Redoran sense of duty towards Morrowind and the House. I'd assume messengers are sent out to inform Redoran's heroes, but most would be aware of what's happening and already be packing their bags. Anyone can attend these meetings, and it is likely that a lot of people do and that the meeting lasts for several days or even weeks, with delegations arriving over time.

Now, while anyone can attend these meetings, the Redoran know their place. While our elder mine owner friend from Bodrem would probably go there, or at least send a messenger, to pledge the support of the village and the mine's resources, he won't engage in military discussions. After all, he knows there are greater leaders in the House, with more experience on the field of battle and a greater amount of warriors at their disposal. The able bodied warriors of Bodrem would likely pledge themselves to the war party of such heroes, probably the one with the closest ties to their family. These heroes, who the people look up to because of their status, experience, accomplishments et cetera, and who would naturally lead the discussion during these meetings, are the Masters of the House and of Councilman rank in game. They embody the Redoran ideals and adhere to the true noble's code. One of them takes the title of Archmaster, because all meetings need a chairman. If the House decides to go to war, they appoint a Hortator, though this title is often bestowed upon the Archmaster because the latter title is usually claimed by the greatest hero of the house to begin with. Duels during these meetings are not uncommon in order to determine the pecking order, though obviously not to the death unless the two families have a particularly bitter dispute going on.

2. The Redoran haven't really expanded on Vvardenfell. Gnisis, Maar Gan and Ald'ruhn are old towns, and there's no real reason to assume hamlets like Khuul are all that new either. Vvardenfell was a temple holding and only recently opened to the Imperials. But where there are Dunmer, there are Great Houses, and many of the Dunmer settlements on Vvardenfell existed long before the Imperial colonization. However, Redoran respects the legion, to the point where they donated a bugshell building to the Gnisis garrison to use as barracks. Their main problem seems to be with Hlaalu gaining influence through the Imperials, as shown by the Caldera mine quests. Though simply by being on Vvardenfell the Redoran ensure that the Imperials can't claim another portion of the island for themselves. Honestly though, they seem to be more concerned with Telvanni expansionism rather than Imperial expansionism.

Note that the one thing doesn't exclude the other and that I'm pretty much making things up as I go Razz but the threat of Dagoth Ur is far more serious than imperial expansion.

3. That's mainly me trying to explain why Ramoran is in Skar, rather than in Gnisis. Councilors aren't required to live near their council building, though I suppose it comes in handy, but remember that the Ald'ruhn Council was formed at a time of crisis. Presumably Ramoran is one of the Masters that answered the call to action, and decided to stay in Ald'ruhn with his retainers because that's what the other nobles did, too. It wouldn't make a lot of sense to be the only member of the Ald'ruhn council not located in Ald'ruhn. Skar was the ancient meeting place of the House, these nobles just took over and moved in when they decided to reform the Ald'ruhn council.

4. I'd love to have a Nordic counterpart to the endgame, but we'll focus on getting the Redoran story right first. I don't want to compromise the awesomeness of the Redoran part just to keep the possibility of a Nordic counterpart open, so we'll see once we get there. If implementing a Nordic side requires us to limit the Redoran side, we won't do it.

_________________
Oh, how rarely wisdom rules our hearts!
Post Sun Dec 30, 2012 4:38 pm Send private message       Send e-mail       Reply with quote                   up  
Why
Lead Developer
04 Jul 2009

Location: Utrecht

Phew. Done. Hah. I sure have a lot to say about Dem Reds.
_________________
Oh, how rarely wisdom rules our hearts!
Post Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:16 pm Send private message       Send e-mail       Reply with quote                   up  
Matin Sanguine
Developer
22 Aug 2012

Location: Australia

Thanks for the answers Why, it really helped to clear up what I was unsure about (especially the Council system), as for Uld Vraech, I understand and agree with your position (I wouldn't want to compromise the storyline either, though allowing for a joinable Nord side would be cool, but we will cross that bridge when it comes).
_________________
"SLOAD. SOAP. IS. NOT. SOAP"- TF

"As to where the ash comes from.. fuck if I care." -Sload
Post Mon Dec 31, 2012 1:57 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Lead Developer
06 Feb 2005



Two points of disagreement with this:

First, Kogotel, as presently concepted and interiored, is not a council city. Kartur and Baan Malur both have council halls, Kogotel does not. The building that dominates Kogotel is a monastery. So there are two mainland councils. I would suggest this framework: there were two Redoran marches, a north march and a south march, around which the house was organized, except when a council of the whole house was called to meet at the Skar.

Second, the democratic aspect of it is very unappealing to me and should be subdued.

_________________
This is not my life
Post Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:07 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
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