Idea...

wishmaster · Post by **wishmaster** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 8:40 pm

Yeah, _ME_ posting something useful is.. I mean, was rare. But now I'm back to kick som ass again!

You know, when we start expanding to other provinces like morrowind, hammerfell, etc. I thought of one thing...

Like in the real world, I don't think the "government" would accept illegal emigration/imigration. What about some kind of Passport? So the player can't buy anything in the different provinces before he/she have been "passed" by some kind of "customs", like in the beginning of Morrowind.

This is just some ideas popping out of my head, so excuse bad english or stupid suggestions.

- Wishmaster

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 8:46 pm

I like this idea a lot, and would certainly get the PC to, If he were to attempt bringing in his favoured items from another country, try 'hopping the border', to avoid customs.

Colhir · Post by **Colhir** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 8:49 pm

personally i think its a bad idea. i just dont see a need for it. i'd rather be killing things than passing an imigration test.

wishmaster · Post by **wishmaster** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:07 pm

Hm.. Yeah, that's an opinion.

What I meant, was that you have to identify yourself to a office of some kind, like when the player "arrive" in morrowind. Got the point?

If I was a leader of a country, I would have border guards, at least on the roads and maybe on some outposts along the border. I don't think the Emperor would think it's so funny if he found out that a mob of robbers/raiders or whatever just walked into cyrodiil without being checked in some way.

Colhir · Post by **Colhir** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:32 pm

Yeh i understand where your comming from. I see a need for some transition from Hammerfell to Cyrodiil or vice versa. Just i dont see a need for a customs but the more i think about it the more i'm for it. oh well we'll wait and see if this happens.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 11:20 pm

although nothing as drastic as the original idea, i think it would be tight to have the boarder forts check for stolen/ilegal goods.

bout those border forts, we have to build em

Colhir · Post by **Colhir** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:04 pm

Yeh if it wasnt as drastic as the 1st idea it would be good. after all it is a fantasy world and not real life, and the other thing of someone having to build the forts and posiblly fences along the borders.

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:19 pm

technically, it should be illegal to cross borders, to the extent of my knowledge, some places more than other. Remember the law prohibiting crossing the Skyrim border to Morrowind (that is, of course, if you get punished by the imperials first)

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:28 pm

Well we all remember the census and excise office of Vvardenfell. I think we are pretty much obliged to have some form of border guard...not to mention the fact that we will need a barrier between exterior spaces.

Also taxes seem pretty necessary if they have offices to collect them. This would involve flagging items as which province they came from. Then honest merchants would not trade in them, and to get 'clean' versions one must report to a Census office and pay the tax (eg 1 septim per loaf of bread) at which point the item would be converted to one for that province. Would be pretty elaborate, but would make for a nice load of smuggling possibilities.

the Bard · Post by **the Bard** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:51 pm

If Jale's idea would be used, we should be able to put the idea I posted her: http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=15652 in it.
For the people that don't want to click the link I'll put it in short. Objects from different countries should have a different price in another country for trading purposes.

wishmaster · Post by **wishmaster** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 4:40 pm

Hm... I didn't mean a barrier. Dude, that would harm the freedom Bethsoft put in these games!

I just thought that if you walk from cyrodiil to morrowind and into a dumner shop, you can't buy anything without a so called "cleared" passport. And it have to be approved in a border guard office or something. But it should be possible to sneak over the border...

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:45 pm

I don't think they would really worry too much at all about people moving across borders, but perhaps when you first try to enter a main city in that country you will be forced to report to an officer who will check your papers off and 'clear' you. Once cleared you can enter any city in that country, but the process would be repeated when you move to another country.

Of course, moving through a checkpoint on the border would sort this out too.

I do think we need to have a taxation system on specific imports/exports, such as Cyrodillic Brandy, to justify their being a Census and Excise Office at all.

wishmaster · Post by **wishmaster** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:07 pm

or Flin.

Hahah, I'm gonna smuggle 150 bottles mazte over to hammerfell, and sell them there for a really high charge!

We'll have to check with the dialouge and scripting possibilities in Oblivion on that part first, I think. To see if it's possible.

Scott MacDonald · Post by **Scott MacDonald** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:46 pm

Colhir wrote:i'd rather be killing things than passing an imigration test.

Thats why you try to get caught

edog99 · Post by **edog99** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:27 am

There for we need some kind of unhostile smugglers network
that can give some smuggling alternativs like: somgglerls taverns,lairs and ships...

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:15 am

It would be quite cool to set it up as an invisible faction, so your rank and even membership are hidden from the layer.

You are never really a 'member', you just sorta do your smuggling jobs and invisibly increase in rank. For example, you 'join' after a shady bloke near a border crossing asks you to take a bottle of something to a pub in Hammerfell. If you oblige you are marked as being in the faction, but it doesnt appear on your list (like the Nerevarine faction of Morrowind). Rather than having any real organisation at all, if you frequent the down and out bars you might pick up random smugglers jobs, which increase you in rank again and again. Once you have done a lot, you will actually get job offers from merchants and guilds who want to be discreet. Eventually you might even be able to set up a smugglers network of your own.

The whole 'hidden from player' thing was underused in Morrowind, I think this would be really fun.

the Bard · Post by **the Bard** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 2:09 pm

Great idea Jale! This would make it sort of smuggling faction whithout it actually being a faction.

edog99 · Post by **edog99** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:56 pm

Mmm...
I like your idea jale this is exactly what missing in TR, The: "hidden from player factions" good work Jale!

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:58 pm

the Bard wrote:Great idea Jale! This would make it sort of smuggling faction whithout it actually being a faction.

Hehe also the illusion that the player is doing what he wants, while really he is on invisible rails

salmonix · Post by **salmonix** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 4:25 pm

Colhir wrote:Yeh if it wasnt as drastic as the 1st idea it would be good. after all it is a fantasy world and not real life, and the other thing of someone having to build the forts and posiblly fences along the borders.

Fantasy has effect if it has a smell of reality. This Aristotelian concept has not been overridden. I think real elements would enhance the effect of this world.

Indoril · Post by **Indoril** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 3:33 am

The Census and Exise office is probably only their for the convinience of transferring prisoners (Exise) and keeping track of population (Census).

I'm sorry, but I think such a direct appliance of a modern issue is perhaps a bit much. Perhaps a problem within one or two province, not empire wide, would be better. Maybe between two provinces that hate eachother. Unfortunately, the only provinces I can think of are Morrowind and Skyrim. Unfortunately, that isn't an option. I sadly can't think of any application to hammerfell.

El Scumbago · Post by **El Scumbago** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 7:05 am

I'll try to support Jale's idea for 3 reasons: Second, because I like it, and third, because it can make for some very interesting complications and be used in quests.

The first reason is the most important; these are troubling times for the whole empire. We have an Oblivion crisis, and then we have no emperor. Panic and chaos are all over Tamriel and any king would want to know who and what is passing through his borders, especially in such a period.

The second reason is totally subjective and cannot be furhter analyzed.

The third reason; Except of the thrill it would be to try crossing the borders undetected, we could make a quest to aqcuire the proper papers, in a legal or illegal way. The smuggling idea is also nice, and could be used in faction/guild quests too (thieves guild asking you to help them smuggle 45 wagons filled with skooma!) or misc quests (something like the GTA's illegal transportations, where after the tenth mission you can keep it up and receive more missions of random difficulty and reward).

salmonix · Post by **salmonix** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 2:55 pm

Indoril wrote:The Census and Exise office is probably only their for the convinience of transferring prisoners (Exise) and keeping track of population (Census).

I'm sorry, but I think such a direct appliance of a modern issue is perhaps a bit much. Perhaps a problem within one or two province, not empire wide, would be better. Maybe between two provinces that hate eachother. Unfortunately, the only provinces I can think of are Morrowind and Skyrim. Unfortunately, that isn't an option. I sadly can't think of any application to hammerfell.

As I remember at the beginning you can find a dead tax collector on the way. That means this beautiful and admirable occupation exists in Morrowind. Where you find tax collector, penalties and arrests, you find Domesday books and further administration. Even in troubled times. Probably a compromise would be to make reference to their existence, and make the entrance to certain walled cities and probably some bridges paying. Our adventurer is not a settled person thus can avoid taxation.
However, this level of tax authorities leads nothing if we can not enter this game - like being an officer responsible for an area. But this might require too much work to develop.

Tamriel Rebuilt

Idea...

Idea...

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