Gates of Hammerfell

Sezarus · Post by **Sezarus** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:28 pm

Hi i joined on 9/04/06. Im not a modder just a member at the moment, but i thought this needed to be said. Since as we are building Hammerfell in TESIV CS, perhaps the main way to enter hammerfell would be through gates. If we did this, we would probabely have to build roads in cyrodiil leading to the gates, (built in the mountains) because we dont really want it to look shabby with gates and no roads leading to them... If anyone has any other ideas, or if the method of entering Hammerfell has already been decided and i have overlooked it pleae reply and get this topic started.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:35 pm

Unless it was in the same worldspace and they just walked there..

Sezarus · Post by **Sezarus** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:38 pm

You mean like a gap in the mountains? to walk through right? oh yeah i thought about entering a new cell.... do'h. well ofcourse Cyrodiil and Hammerfell are going to be all exterior, i forgot about that. But still if you were travelling from Cyrodiil to Hammerfell you'd expect big gates with guards garrisoned right?

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:40 pm

One road is guarded by Rihad. There would be a gate there. If the second road, from Chorrol, has a gate added to it, that's the modder who made it's decision.

The Old Ye Bard · Post by **The Old Ye Bard** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:42 pm

Sload wrote:Unless it was in the same worldspace and they just walked there..

It's highly unlikly this would happen because of frame rate Issues and unpractacality.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:49 pm

Stop pretending you know what you're talking about. No evidence suggests that adding to Cyrodiil's worldspace would be either "unpractacal" or cause frame rates issues. In fact, all evidence suggests that it would work dandy.

Sezarus · Post by **Sezarus** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:50 pm

worldspace means its all exterior right?
infact, ofcourse the modders will make it all exterior, or else the map wouldnt contain both regions

Eyeball88 · Post by **Eyeball88** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:53 pm

Sezarus wrote:worldspace means its all exterior right?
infact, ofcourse the modders will make it all exterior, or else the map wouldnt contain both regions

It means that the entire province of Hammerfell will be in the same exterior "worldspace" as Cyrodiil, so you can walk across the border and have some fun. No activating portals, etc.

Edit: Bethesda included a rudimentary "heightmapped" exterior of every province circling Cyrodiil so the "terrain detail" is already there, with no effect on our gameplay.

knightmare · Post by **knightmare** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:53 pm

The Old Ye Bard wrote:
Sload wrote:Unless it was in the same worldspace and they just walked there..
It's highly unlikly this would happen because of frame rate Issues and unpractacality.

why would there be any issues? unless you can find a way to be in every single cell in the worldspace at one time it wouldnt effect it at all, except for possibly load times. but it would effect load times even if they were seperate worldspaces anyway

The Old Ye Bard · Post by **The Old Ye Bard** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:57 pm

Sload wrote:Stop pretending you know what you're talking about. No evidence suggests that adding to Cyrodiil's worldspace would be either "unpractacal" or cause frame rates issues. In fact, all evidence suggests that it would work dandy.

They removed a whole citie because of it. also we would have to alter Beth's basic height map of Hammerfell, which I'm pretty sure means changing their oringinal work, also the genaral concensus is set on doing it in a seperate worldspace.

Sezarus: World spaces are completly differnt worlds that are exteriors themselves but are seperate worldspaces.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:00 pm

There is no consensus and they didn't remove a city because of technical restraints. I have no idea where you got your information.

Morden · Post by **Morden** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:02 pm

the genaral concensus is set on doing it in a seperate worldspace.

There is no consensus yet. When we figure out everything it will be decided.

Sezarus · Post by **Sezarus** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:05 pm

knightmare wrote:
The Old Ye Bard wrote:
Sload wrote:Unless it was in the same worldspace and they just walked there..
It's highly unlikly this would happen because of frame rate Issues and unpractacality.
why would there be any issues? unless you can find a way to be in every single cell in the worldspace at one time it wouldnt effect it at all, except for possibly load times. but it would effect load times even if they were seperate worldspaces anyway

I completely agree, you only possess 1 cell at a time, I just thought gates would obey lore on borders of tamrielan nations

Sezarus · Post by **Sezarus** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:08 pm

What is the consensus? Is it a group of chosen TR members, who decide the decisions to be made for Hammerfell?

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:44 pm

Most decisions are reached by consensus in the Private Tavern. Other decisions are voted on by the core members (general moderators and administrators)

As far as the border issue goes, I think it might be possible to script a relatively smooth transition from one world space to the next. If we were to place markers(invisible) along the border and script these so that they would teleport the PC to a position in the other worldspace, I believe it could be done relatively seamlessly. The script could be written so that the PC's position in the new land would be calculated using his GetPos on his current position. We would, of course, have to build copy-past bits of identical land into the respective world spaces.
The script would work something like this:

-GetDistance from the marker, if less than some distance,
-GetPos on the player
-Use some teleport command(an equivalent of CenterOnCell, but for Worldspaces)
-Calculate a new x, y and z value based on the values returned by GetPos (this would just be adding/subtracting a constant)
-Plug these values into SetPos on the player

I haven't used OB's scripting , but I don't see any problems with this. People cant levitate over the top because levitate doesn't exist. There would probably be one skipping of stuff, but it would fall within the paramaters of normal loading pauses, more than likely.

Opinions please.

Morden · Post by **Morden** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:45 pm

There is no specific group called the 'consensus'. Basically modders are given the opportunity to toss around ideas and come to a consensus on the Private Tavern board. If its an issue were a more decisive stance is needed the admins decide the best course of action for the project.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:49 pm

There's this really nasty member called "consensus" who makes decisions for us

@Morden: any comments on using my script-based solution?

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:54 pm

Ludovic wrote:Most decisions are reached by consensus in the Private Tavern. Other decisions are voted on by the core members (general moderators and administrators)

As far as the border issue goes, I think it might be possible to script a relatively smooth transition from one world space to the next. If we were to place markers(invisible) along the border and script these so that they would teleport the PC to a position in the other worldspace, I believe it could be done relatively seamlessly. The script could be written so that the PC's position in the new land would be calculated using his GetPos on his current position. We would, of course, have to build copy-past bits of identical land into the respective world spaces.
The script would work something like this:

-GetDistance from the marker, if less than some distance,
-GetPos on the player
-Use some teleport command(an equivalent of CenterOnCell, but for Worldspaces)
-Calculate a new x, y and z value based on the values returned by GetPos (this would just be adding/subtracting a constant)
-Plug these values into SetPos on the player

I haven't used OB's scripting , but I don't see any problems with this. People cant levitate over the top because levitate doesn't exist. There would probably be one skipping of stuff, but it would fall within the paramaters of normal loading pauses, more than likely.

Opinions please.

The border already has an invisible wall that is set in the .ini. If we were to do it on the same scale, it would be possible to do it in a seperate worldspace without requiring the player to use a door. However, this is not as good as just having it actually be in the same worldspace and really for no reason.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 11:00 pm

We can't change the map, remember?

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 11:14 pm

Yes, we can change the map. Yes, this does mean "changing the original game." No, we can't keep from changing the original game because we have to add roads into Hammerfell anyway, or else it will seem unfinished. No, changing the map is not really that big of a deal as far as altering the original game.

Eyeball88 · Post by **Eyeball88** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 11:19 pm

Just re-reading the title of this thread, I had an idea for a main quest which involves closing shut the gates of Hammerfell to stop the cheap illegal immigrants from coming through to Cyrodiil.

Macar · Post by **Macar** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 11:58 pm

At one point we were having an all member vote about the scale isue and this, but a few minutes into it it was locked. Dexter said that people were going to test a heightmap version in current scale and in slightly bigger scale to see A)What it looked like and B)If there were any technical problems.

Did this ever get done? Because it seemed like a damn good idea to me.

sirwootalot123 · Post by **sirwootalot123** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 2:33 pm

I'm working on it, but you have NO IDEA how difficult and time-consuming it is... I'm a huge proponet of a larger scale myself, but regardless of size it still takes DAMN LONG to make an accurate and good-looking heightmap, and it can really only be done by one person.

Vholdrian · Post by **Vholdrian** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 2:34 pm

Eyeball88 wrote:Just re-reading the title of this thread, I had an idea for a main quest which involves closing shut the gates of Hammerfell to stop the cheap illegal immigrants from coming through to Cyrodiil.

LMAO...

Go now, and Close Shut the Jaws of... Hammerfell! Destroy the Prince of illegal Immigration ROFL....

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Dr.zombie · Post by **Dr.zombie** » Mon May 01, 2006 10:47 pm

ÃƒÂ would like Hammerfell to be in the same cell as Cyrodiil even if it means that my computer takes a few hours to load the gameworld...but you canÃ‚Â´t always get what you want