Weekly Think Group 1 - Guild of Fighters and Knightly Orders

Old and generally outdated discussions, with the rare hidden gem. Enter at your own risk.

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Post by Abramul »

Harke the Apostle wrote:... Remember the Greeks and Romans who said that the morally best man had most leisure time?...
The happy life is thought to be one of excellence; now an excellent life requires exertion, and does not consist in amusement. If Eudaimonia, or happiness, is activity in accordance with excellence, it is reasonable that it should be in accordance with the highest excellence; and this will be that of the best thing in us.

-- Aristotle, "Nichomachean Ethics"

If you can discover a better way of life than office-holding for your future rulers, a well-governed city becomes a possibility. For only in such a state will those rule who are truly rich, not in gold, but in the wealth that makes happiness--a good and wise life.
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The chief aim of their constitution and government is that,
whenever public needs permit, all citizens should be free, so far as possible, to withdraw their time and energy from the service of the body, and devote themselves to the freedom and culture of the mind. For that, they think, is the real happiness of life.

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And yes, I know that More wasn't Greek or Roman.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Sid Meyer's Alpha Centaury!(Techtree) :)
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Post by Gnomey »

I'll post my personal ideas, and yes, more bashing of Harke's ideas. :twisted: (j/k)

First, I do not few the Lhutonics as sneaky. Why must the diplomats always have a sneaky under-current? I view them as noble enough. They know of the Imperial strategy but avoid using it with Redguards, as they know that Redguards fight best individually. However, they do believe that strength comes in numbers, so they might have quests like "Go with this group of four knights and kill the evil witch." etc. They use the best items they can get their hands on and are basically a hybrid of Imperial and Redguard style. They are diplomats, but if that fails they can be fierce, well armed warriors. They do not, however, accept any but the least offensive, to them, magic.

Next, the Forebears. Hardly lazy, these are very well trained in Imperial styles and are armed with Imperial weapons. As I said they are not lazy, instead they feel like crushing in the crowns and despite the commander's best efforts, the knights often break ranks if fighting enemies like the crown. They allow magic use, but they too have their limits. No conjuration, necromancy, illusion, some more of the 'worst' spells and they consider it dishonourable to down an enemy with magic like both of the other houses. They sometimes have a small group of spell casters in battles, but this is only in case of extreem need. Though they are Imperialized, they are still Redguard at heart. They often use mercinaries and sometimes diplomacy, but in the latter they are very stubborn, especially with rival knight orders.

Finally, the Crowns. They avoid magic at all costs, though they do allow potions and, perhaps, enchanting. They are very individualistic and their 'evil witch' quest version would be more like: "Go alone into the witch's lair and kill her." In other words, they believe in the individual honour of a hero to the extant that, of the three knight orders, they are considered the 'Hero makers'. They only use large numbers incase of a large-scale attack, such as on a Forebear fort or a dragon. (By the way, I should note that all of these mentions are just examples, I'd hardly expect a large scale knight vs. knight attack and I don't think having a dragon would be a good idea at all, though witches seem reasonable enough). They are warriors, not diplomats, proud, do not like to hire, and well trained in Yoku styles.

So in my view, the knight orders, though affected by political views, rather represent the Redguard, not the faction. I think that's all I have to say, other than I think that most magical services should be provided by a priest, that there should be a temple per order, just a small one, and that, in some cases, magic use will have to be sanctioned by priests or a ranking knight first. [/rant]
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Call me someone who has internalized sexism, but I really don't think we should send five knights to kill one witch.
What will she say on her dying breath?
'Thank Yokuda, I thought chivalry was dead!'?

No, it won't do.

I don't think that any of the playable knightly orders should be particularly given to religious bigotry, if we do what will be left for the Yoku Temple?
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Post by Sload »

  • Lutemoth:
    Before this discussion begins, I must express my enchantment for the knightly order system. While it might lead the mind to conveyably relate it to few earth-cultural distinctions (Samurai mastery, W.European knighthood, ect.), I can't escape how Redguard it could be.. How yokudan, if you will. Ergo, how essentially part of hammerfell it will be.
Yes yes yes.
  • Adanorcil:
    Crowns: They consider themselves the "elite" troups of the rightful rulers of Hammerfell. They are traditionalistic and proud and classic in their ideas of loyalty and valor. Loyalty to your superiors, rulers and to your banner. They walk around in traditional (few exterior/Imperial influences), beautiful, yet functional outfits and take every chance to proclaim themselves, resulting in a lavish use of the crown emblems for decoration. Think of the Swiss Guard, only with less silly outfits. :)
No silly outfits? :( But I agree, they'd be really hardcore loyalty. I'm thinking to the temple.
  • Harke:
    A slightly decadent order where the knights spend time conducting ceremonies (partying), jousting and ordering their page (you) around.

    Motto: I am already best, so why try harder. (They try to make everything they do look effortless (European))

    Quests:

    You begin by cleaning up after the knights. Perhaps buying their food and wine and getting them new extravagant clothes. As you progress you will be entrusted with more and more responsible quests, getting them from the laziest knight first,
    After those you will get rather silly knight-errand quests: Get enchanted item so and so. Defend the honour of lady X and prevent her family from falling from grace (and them losing their considerable estate).
    Save our noble brother ,Sir Merryman, from castle Jolie-Coeur, where an evil sorceres has locked him in her dungeon naked and he gets whipped with stingy nettles every day together with our other brethren of the Order who had the misfortune to fail this mission.
    About reaching the top rank of the order; you can’t . its hereditary. Perhaps the old master dies and you get to be the assistant of his younger nephew. But it doesn’t really matter.

    Stance toward other orders:

    The Crown can’t really touch them, of course the Taneth Order needs to make sure it stays that way.
    They have learnt to live alongside the Lothunic Order, the hard way.

    Size: biggest

    Estate: Sir Raymond Luxury-Yacht. They have their own vinyards. Ranking members live in Mansions or even castles.
First: The word I emphasised. I suggest you don't say things like that, because it rather decreases my liking of the idea. Take things from different cultures (most preferably more than one), but don't tell me. And don't equate anything to a real world culture.

Second: Just no. This is a fecking knightly order. These are warriors, warriors who happen to side with the Forebears. They aren't in charge of the Forebears and while they may be involved in politics, they simply aren't rich snobs. They're knights. Yoku knights. That's bad-ass, not.. whatever this is.
  • Harke:
    Basically their hair is the other way ‘round:

    Men are bald with elaborate beards that are as long as possible

    The women would look like this:

    [url=http://img62.imageshack.us/my.php?image=y2ff3.jpg][img]http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/6742/y2ff3.th.jpg[/img][/url]

    The only reason they do this is to show that they are NOT like the Taneth order.

    Jaguar Warrior:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Jaguar_warrior.jpg
Though I don't care which order each is attached to, I like the shaved heads. I think it's possible, based on what I've seen from sticking people inside of XMarkerHeadings, but for some reason there are no shaved heads in Oblivion. The only thing is, would as many players join with a group that demanded shaved heads?
  • PoHa!:

    Doesn't the PGE list them as the NEWEST of the three orders?
No, it lists the Lhotunic political ideal as the newest.
  • Lady N:
    Besides that, i think that this is not the time to chart out quests, is it?
No, it's not.
  • Harke:
    I don't think that any of the playable knightly orders should be particularly given to religious bigotry, if we do what will be left for the Yoku Temple?
Good question, because that's totally a playable faction and everything.

I didn't respond to a lot of things, but I'm just going to say "NO NO NO" to the idea that these use different style weapons or that they're insanely rich.

-----

Now, my opinions.

First, my justification for saying that dividing things by gameplay is bad. If you disagree, your first thought might be to argue back at me about the mages guild and the fighters guild. I'll clarify the difference for you: with those, you can play both questlines; join both guilds. You can only join one knightly order. How you shape your character should not be guided by what weapon they fight with, but what you think they should think. And that's that.

Second - these orders happen to align themselves with the ideals of certain factions. This does not make them necessarily make them even ranking within the factions, or serving the faction. Please get away with thinking about them like you'd think about the Lhotunics, Crowns, and Forebears.

Now, ideas for the different orders:
  • Crown Order - Very old. Run out of Hegathe and allied internally with the Yoku temple. They love this temple like they love a lot of things that are important, and so forth. The current prince/count/thing of Hegathe is, in their mind, rather unnoble, especially for his close ties to the Kogotong.

    Lhotunic Order - Here's an idea, what if rather than supporting Lhotun's politics, they support the monarchy no matter what. Lhotun does not have much power over his province, most Redguards are loyal to the local whoever. But these knights believe strongly in the centralized monarchy. The Knights of the Leviathan, if you will.

    Forebear Order - I don't actually have any ideas on that for now.
As to the fighters' guild, I think most of them would give you contracts and when you completed two or so they'd sign. There's probably one, though, who's just a hardass. To get his signature you have to survive in battle with him for like some number of seconds. :D
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Sload wrote: Second: Just no. This is a fecking knightly order. These are warriors, warriors who happen to side with the Forebears. They aren't in charge of the Forebears and while they may be involved in politics, they simply aren't rich snobs. They're knights. Yoku knights. That's bad-ass, not.. whatever this is.
Knighthood was hardly a full-time job, but the rich ‘effortless’ faction can do without the mansions, the vineyard and the castle. Still I would like them to live in the biggest of the three knightly order lodgings, and they should have lots and lots of wine because, like George Michael said, that’s their culture.

Where will the Orders be lodged? Do they have to put up with the backroom of the mages guild? Do they have a fighters guild like building, but with different banners? Are there barracks in the local castle?

How do the knights behave when they are in the barracks? Will there be lots of towel snapping? The Forebears certainly should have some party facility.
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Post by Sload »

  • Harke, who has failed at noticing the unanimous disagreement:
    Knighthood was hardly a full-time job, but the rich ‘effortless’ faction can do without the mansions, the vineyard and the castle. Still I would like them to live in the biggest of the three knightly order lodgings, and they should have lots and lots of wine because, like George Michael said, that’s their culture.
Since fucking when?
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Post by Haplo »

I think asking where knightly orders live is kind of a dumb question.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Sload wrote:
  • Harke, who has failed at noticing the unanimous disagreement:
    Knighthood was hardly a full-time job, but the rich ‘effortless’ faction can do without the mansions, the vineyard and the castle. Still I would like them to live in the biggest of the three knightly order lodgings, and they should have lots and lots of wine because, like George Michael said, that’s their culture.
Since fucking when?
Wikipedia wrote: The word knight derives from Old English cniht, meaning page boy, or servant (as is still the case in the cognate Dutch knecht and German Knecht for servant), or simply boy. Knighthood, as Old English cnihthad, had the meaning of adolescence, i.e. the period between childhood and manhood. The sense of (adult) lieutenant of a king or other superior was in existence at least as early as 1100, although there are signs of it as early as Alfred's Orosius.
At least since 1100 A.D.
Wikipedia wrote: However, over time, as this class of fighter became more prominent in post-Carolingian France, they became wealthier and began to hold and inherit land. Eventually, on the Continent of Europe, only those men could be knighted whose fathers or grandfathers had been knights; and the knightly families became known as the nobility. (In the British Isles, "nobility" is more restricted, to the Peerage.)
There you have it. The knights came from the richest families around.

If you want to move away from what the term knight actually means, be my guest. But do it for the right reasons, not because you don't quite understand how knighthood works.
Haplo wrote:I think asking where knightly orders live is kind of a dumb question.


I don't think so. It reflects their position in society, and I'd rather not say what i think is dumb...

snaps towel with Forebear coat of arms on backside of Haplo...
Last edited by Harke the Apostle on Wed Sep 13, 2006 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Sload »

SLAMS HEAD AGAINST DESK

I'm not even dignifying that with a response. Try to read Lutemoth's post and then maybe you'll get it.

(And for the general public, the word 'chivalry' is now banned.)
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Post by Tyrion »

Weren't we going to keep this civil?
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Post by Sload »

Trust me, this is very civil.
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Post by Noirgrim »

There's so many different types of orders of knighthood in period, to sum up what knighthood means with a single paragraph is almost nonsensicle.

There is also a difference between being 'Knighted' and being a 'Knight' (the former being inducted to an order and the latter simply being a mounted soldier... and that's even a broad generalization).

Being in a Knighthood or being Knighted ranged from being a Knight of the Garter (original knighthood established in England for simply sevitude to the Crown or the Kingdom) all the way to Lords in the middle east 'knighting' hundrends of people at one time to raise moral (yes I reference 'Kingdom of Heaven' but that's what they really did).

So, in conclusion, Kighhood or Knightly Orders can pretty much be anything we want them to be. There are some already in OB, so keeping 'close' to what they started would be a good starting point.
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Post by Sload »

Noirgrim wrote:So, in conclusion, Kighhood or Knightly Orders can pretty much be anything we want them to be. There are some already in OB, so keeping 'close' to what they started would be a good starting point.
I think it would be a bad one. The Yoku and the Nedics have very different cultures.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

@ Noirgrim:

I missed the ones in OB, what were they like?
Going back to Daggerfall for inspiration for our orders wouldn't hurt.

You are right that knighthood is a very broad term an can even be applied to such people as the Xia, men from the Inca nobility and the Eagle warriors, but it is not so broad as warrior or fighter. Most knights were better off than your average Tom, Dick and Harry, and some historical orders were filthy rich. As for the wine, they would need to drink something.
Last edited by Harke the Apostle on Wed Sep 13, 2006 12:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Noirgrim »

Sload wrote: I think it would be a bad one. The Yoku and the Nedics have very different cultures.
Good point, but so did Knights from Thomas Mann's 'Faust' (not Goethe's 'Faust'). But the two knights (one Christian and one Islamic) had very similar beliefs in what it meant to be virtious and honorable but were almost forced to hate eachother because of their difference in religions.

/me shrugs, but this is Tamriel and not 13th century Europe, so, let's do what we want.
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Post by Macar »

And I think we all agree that playing a character who sits around being rich would be the lamest thing ever.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Macar wrote:And I think we all agree that playing a character who sits around being rich would be the lamest thing ever.
They are that very different from the fighters guild, they just tend to let the squires pollish their armour and they can afford more expensive booze.

Their being a rich order makes them more apt for having knight-errand quests.
Last edited by Harke the Apostle on Wed Sep 13, 2006 12:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Haplo »

I think Sload meant 'since when has it been their culture to be drunk all the time'.

And uh... 'Where does the army live? In the back of a mages guild building?' just seems kind of...well...
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Post by Dexter »

Not to undermine the authority of Sload, but I want to add a stipulation to the rules of the Weekly Think Group:
It requires thinking.
Citing Wikipedia as a source for lore info on knights is not thinking. Because we have named these Knightly Orders does not mean that they ride around on horseback going to jousting competitions, eating mutton chops and drinking mead. They probably don't have kite shields with eagle or griffon icons, they certainly don't have their own castles and fiefdoms, and I'd be willing to bet my left testicle that they don't know what the word "chivalry" means.
We are talking about the Redguard here. Hammerfell is full of the most badass motherfuckers in Tamriel, and no culture on Earth comes close to their way of life. Therefore, you cannot cite Wiki-freakin-pedia as a source for info on ANY aspect of their culture.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Haplo wrote:I think Sload meant 'since when has it been their culture to be drunk all the time'.
Because in Europe for a very long time EVERYBODY drank alcoholic beverages almost exclusively, including toddlers. Who could afford it drank wine.
And if they drunk wine all the time they wouldn't be drunk.
Haplo wrote:And uh... 'Where does the army live? In the back of a mages guild building?' just seems kind of...well...
My bad. I meant fighters guild.
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Post by Sload »

Dexter wrote:Not to undermine the authority of Sload, but I want to add a stipulation to the rules of the Weekly Think Group:
It requires thinking.
Citing Wikipedia as a source for lore info on knights is not thinking. Because we have named these Knightly Orders does not mean that they ride around on horseback going to jousting competitions, eating mutton chops and drinking mead. They probably don't have kite shields with eagle or griffon icons, they certainly don't have their own castles and fiefdoms, and I'd be willing to bet my left testicle that they don't know what the word "chivalry" means.
We are talking about the Redguard here. Hammerfell is full of the most badass motherfuckers in Tamriel, and no culture on Earth comes close to their way of life. Therefore, you cannot cite Wiki-freakin-pedia as a source for info on ANY aspect of their culture.
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Dexter wrote:Not to undermine the authority of Sload, but I want to add a stipulation to the rules of the Weekly Think Group:
It requires thinking.
I think Sload covered that in calling it 'Weekly Think Group 1'
Dexter wrote: Citing Wikipedia as a source for lore info on knights is not thinking.
It's not meant as thinking, it is a reference material that can be used to come up with ideas.
Dexter wrote: We are talking about the Redguard here. Hammerfell is full of the most badass motherfuckers in Tamriel, and no culture on Earth comes close to their way of life. Therefore, you cannot cite Wiki-freakin-pedia as a source for info on ANY aspect of their culture.
If we are redoing some historical group, and we will be ending up doing that anyway, shouldn't we have some references handy?
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Post by Haplo »

Historical group?
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Haplo wrote:Historical group?
You said it man...
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Post by Noirgrim »

Harke the Apostle wrote: If we are redoing some historical group, and we will be ending up doing that anyway, shouldn't we have some references handy?
I'll have to agree with that. Unless there's a complete lore reference of Orders in Hammerfell, without references, we are just making stuff up (which is fine if that's what we are doing, but then I'd say anything anyone says is acceptable to be added). Almost everything in Tamriel and ES lore in general is based, at least loosly, on period references.
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Post by Dexter »

"Loosly" being the operative word there.
Now, I am somewhat okay with using the cultures of Arabia, India, and Shaolin as our influences for Redguard culture. But why do I shit dynamite when I see references to European knighthood? Because European knights were the most BORING people ever to live. Even the tales of King Arthur put me to sleep. Hammerfell is simply TOO COOL for boringness.
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Post by Noirgrim »

Well, depending on how many references one can dig up, they could easily turn 'loosly' into 'strongly.'

But as for everything else... ok... [retreats back to exteriors].
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Dexter wrote:"Loosly" being the operative word there.
Now, I am somewhat okay with using the cultures of Arabia, India, and Shaolin as our influences for Redguard culture. But why do I shit dynamite when I see references to European knighthood? Because European knights were the most BORING people ever to live. Even the tales of King Arthur put me to sleep. Hammerfell is simply TOO COOL for boringness.

Reading Medievil novels about knights is like reading realy bad science fiction. However the entire concept is interesting for a couple of reasons, a few of them very naughty. I like the idea of the platonic but nonetheless aldulterous relationships they had with other peoples wives. I am also fond of their distinctlty unpuritanical stance on sensuality. They are also highly ambiguous in that they are brutal killers and like innocent children at the same time.

Tomorrow I will see if I can come up with an updated 'concept' and maybe critisize a few others on the way.
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Post by Sload »

I think European knighthood is the best thing to stay away from simply because that's the stereotype of what a knight is.
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Post by Noirgrim »

Also, the European knight has been very romanticized mainly due to 19th century literary works, and such references should be avoided. And secondarily, more middle-eastern knighthoods should be referenced to form a basis for HF Knightly Orders (as stated previously).
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Post by Nanu »

Now, I am somewhat okay with using the cultures of Arabia, India, and Shaolin as our influences for Redguard culture. But why do I shit dynamite when I see references to European knighthood? Because European knights were the most BORING people ever to live. Even the tales of King Arthur put me to sleep. Hammerfell is simply TOO COOL for boringness.
Influences.

This is Nirn, not Earth. Basing out made-up lore purely on Earth's history and culture makes no sense. Sload summed it up rather verbosely when he said:
...This is world where the culmination of all Khajiit getting high on sugar keeps the moons from disappearing. A world where ritualistic homicide can create enough magick to power a god. A world where an entire race disappeared simply because one of them played Strawberry Fields Forever on a magick stone. A world where time will split into 8 pieces if you do the macarena in the right place. A world where anyone can use magick to do what in our world is impossible, anyone. A world where gods are real. A world where the planet is a sphere, an infinite plane, and a dragon all at once. A world where the undead run about because some people want them to, and where those peoples leader split into two and one half went to fight with a god. A world where the first human empress was in love with a man who was a winged bull with metal skin, a minotaur, and a regular guy all at once. A world where some people will look completely different depending on where the moons were at the time of their birth. A world where thinking something is a perfectly reasonable way to create it....
It is understandable that we can only draw so much out of pure imagination, but copy and pasting 17th century France into our project would be dull, unimaginative, and lame.
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Noirgrim
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Post by Noirgrim »

Nanu Ra wrote:
This is world where the culmination of all Khajiit getting high on sugar keeps the moons from disappearing.
Certain South American tribes believe that using hallucinogens is the only way to talk to their gods, and if they don't talk to them, they will be destroyed.
Nanu Ra wrote: A world where ritualistic homicide can create enough magick to power a god.
The Inca made ritual sacrifices to appease their god and give him power.
Nanu Ra wrote: A world where anyone can use magick to do what in our world is impossible, anyone.
Many African and South American tribes believe certain trained persons do use magic and that magic is real.
Nanu Ra wrote: A world where gods are real.
Many people think their gods are real.
Nanu Ra wrote: A world where the undead run about because some people want them to.
Dia de los Muertos is a Mexican holiday where the dead come back from the after-life to socialize and feast with their families.
Nanu Ra wrote: A world where some people will look completely different depending on where the moons were at the time of their birth.
Astrologist think this also, among many other things.

(And please don't claim these things aren't 'real' because some people 'do' think they are real)

My point is that almost everything, whether it is from our imagination or from stories we've heard or whereever, is mostly probably based in reality. Even the world of Nirn was made from people who draw from experience, history, and their imaginations. So, really, if people want to site sources for info, it is a perfectly viable way to draw backgrounds for what we are creating here... and if you don't want to draw lore upon sources, but rather your imagination (which I claim to be influeced by what you've experience in your life-time which is based here/earth thus history) that's fine also. Let's move away from how we draw influeces on what we are creating here, and start creating.
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Sload
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Post by Sload »

Nanu, you used that post incorrectly. And this is all irrelevant. Let's talk about something cool.
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Post by Macar »

I'm glad this isnt happening in the WSG thread! then again, nothing is...
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Sload wrote:Let's talk about something cool.
Lets focus on something else now.
something cool:

eckrotic.. um exotic weapons:

Blunt:

Chakra
Wahaika
Pou Tangata
Labrys
Quauhololli


Ranged (yes I know but you wanted cool):

thrown:

Battle jojo
Atlatl(spear thrower)
bolas

bows:

Arlabest
Chu-ko-nu

misc:

blow-pipe with darts

Sword:

Maquahuitl
Khukuri

Short sword:

Varja
kathar


Misc:

Dwemer Dorje (hand held thunderbolt device)can be used to zap opponents.Powerful, but only has three charges.

My latest idea is to give the three orders the same skills and weapon classes, but to have different weapons of the same class for each order. So in Morrowind terms one order would use axes, the second would use staffs and the third cudgels.

prefereably at least one order would use one of our custom weapon meshes.

My personal favourite of the exotic weapons is the Maquahuitl or Macana (lets use that name as it's not so obviously Aztec) it's a stick with sharp pieces of stone inserted into the sides. You could say it is either a sword for hewing with, or a thin cudgel that has razors applied to it.
In game it would work as the sharpest normal sword-class there is, but to balance things out it would need to be repaired the soonest. This would be realistic as stone weapons break and lose their sharpness very quickly.

If Macana is too obvious we could look up what 'stone-beard' is in Arabic.
Last edited by Harke the Apostle on Wed Sep 13, 2006 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Orix
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Post by Orix »

Harke the Apostle wrote:<snip, post about weapons etc>
I hope you're being sarcastic with some of those suggestions. While I dont know what a lot of them are (its kinda annoying to look up each one on google pictures, I'm sure many others will think the same) things like "spear throwers", "Chu-ko-nu" (aka cross-bow) and "bolas" would probabaly require new animations wouldn't they?

As far as I know, we wouldn't be able to make those for the player to use, which would kinda suck.
My latest idea is to give the three orders the same skills and weapon classes, but to have different weapons of the same class for each order. So in Morrowind terms one order would use axes, the second would use staffs and the third cudgels.
The three orders all have the same skills but only have preference for one weapon type?

I prefer the idea, and this is basically emphasised in the Dark Brotherhood Sanctuary in Oblivion, that knights are individuals who fight differently to each other. Just because they're "knights" it doesn't mean they all have to use the same weapon and have the same skill experiance as if they all went to the same school...
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Post by Harke the Apostle »

Orix wrote:
Harke the Apostle wrote:<snip, post about weapons etc>
I hope you're being sarcastic with some of those suggestions. While I dont know what a lot of them are (its kinda annoying to look up each one on google pictures, I'm sure many others will think the same) things like "spear throwers" and "bolas" would probabaly require new animations wouldn't they?
Merely ironic. On looking them up; I know two members from the moderating team who don't want historical reference, and wanted to banish wiki quotes from the WTG. Thank them.
Orix wrote: The three orders all have the same skills but only have preference for one weapon type?
I guess I haven't explained this idea clearly enough. If they have only one weapon type or every weapon type in the game is not important. I leave that up to the people who know more about the game mechanics and questing. They would have the same types of weapons, but not the same weapons. They wouldn't frown upon other weapons, but if you did a quest for them, or bought a weapon from your order you would only get the weapon they use.(unless of course you sold them another type that you buy back).
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Post by Noirgrim »

Crossbows and Thrown items can not be added to OB (at least we will not be adding them).
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Post by El Scumbago »

Guys guys guys, why are we making it hard? Let's start from the easy stuff, shall we? Here's my view of things:

1) Knight Orders in Cyrodiil are as follows; There is one different order per county (minus the western counties) and they are directly related to them via the symbol of the nearby city and the area they operate within. Brotherhood of the Pure Blood is not considered to be such an order since it is not official, but rather underground (early goths I'd say).

2) These Orders are mostly found in eastern Cyrodiil, since that's the most troublesome borderline (Morrowind & Black Marsh). So, these Orders are necessary only in areas as problematic and dangerous as these. My guess is that Hammerfell's similar Orders should exist near the Skyrim borders, since Nords are known to be war-loving people.


If Sload agrees in my second point, then we should consider taking a closer look to the eastern cities and counties of HF and see what special characteristics they have and how these could affect the respective Orders.
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