WSG#21[F]: Dragonstar, The northern point of Hammerfell

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 7:46 pm

WSG#21[F]: Dragonstar, The northern point of Hammerfell

Welcome, once again! We certainly had a turnout in our last update, so what say we try to match that again, eh?

Now, as far as planning goes, Dragonstar is not particularily the top of the list. However, ideas and planning still remain valid, so keep your cranium open. To refresh your memory, Dragonstar is the northernmost city to our endevour. Sharing a triadic border between High Rock and Skyrim, outlanding influence is inevitable. To gain an idea, [url=http://til.gamingsource.net/maps/]The Imperial Library[/url] hosts an assortment of maps for the occasion:

In particular:
-[url=http://til.gamingsource.net/maps/map_hf_names.jpg]Zephyr's detailed Hammerfell map[/url]

To make things open-ended, you are welcome to detail any or all of Dragonstar. That includes single buildings, architectural planning, unique features, city life, interiors, exteriors, you name it. As long as you are inspired, it's acceptable!

Submitted results

Swiftoak Woodwarrior
[url=http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wsg21inkrz0.jpg][img]http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/5266/wsg21inkrz0.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Harke the Apostle
[url=http://img236.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarsketch1yj0.jpg][img]http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/9623/dragonstarsketch1yj0.th.jpg[/img][/url][url=http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=onionornamenthm2.jpg][img]http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/5606/onionornamenthm2.th.jpg[/img][/url][url=http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=signemblemsmaskso0.jpg][img]http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8522/signemblemsmaskso0.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Lutemoth
[url=http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/389/dragonstarbr9.jpg][img]http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/389/dragonstarbr9.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Gnomey
[url=http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarcyn8.jpg][img]http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8249/dragonstarcyn8.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Saithan
[url=http://img224.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nore1by2.jpg][img]http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/7291/nore1by2.th.jpg[/img][/url]

lb003g0676 (Pound)
[url=http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstararmourip4.jpg][img]http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/4927/dragonstararmourip4.th.jpg[/img][/url][url=http://img360.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstararmourcopycolourcopyea1.jpg][img]http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/3690/dragonstararmourcopycolourcopyea1.th.jpg[/img][/url][url=http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarcityzt3.jpg][img]http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2869/dragonstarcityzt3.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Abramul · Post by **Abramul** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:10 pm

Not sure if Shadowkey is counted as official, but if so, here's a map that might be more useful.

http://til.gamingsource.net/tsosk/chapter05.shtml

Post by **Swiftoak** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:13 pm

Nice. I might be able to submit one

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:14 pm

Abramul wrote:Not sure if Shadowkey is counted as official, but if so, here's a map that might be more useful.

Yes, and this is also a topic worthy for any and all suggestions, ideas, opinions on Dragonstar. Other than Shadowkey (I think, there could be another), the general image of Dragonstar is limited and vague

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:16 pm

Shadowkey is official, but gorramn is that a shitty map.

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:25 pm

agreed. I'm not sure how citizens could come to terms with living inside a block of tetris

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:33 pm

Woah, I'm having de javu.

Not only am I having de javu.. I'm having de javu of having de javu of this.

Oh.. now it's passed. Wierd feeling.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 11:02 pm

[url=http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wsg21inkrz0.jpg][img]http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/5266/wsg21inkrz0.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Harke the Apostle · Post by **Harke the Apostle** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:07 pm

[url=http://img236.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarsketch1yj0.jpg][img]http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/9623/dragonstarsketch1yj0.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:09 pm

Sload wrote:Shadowkey is official, but gorramn is that a shitty map.

It's fine as far as Shadowkey's gameplay limitations are taken into account. That means that we can still use it as a general guide to where the important buildings are located -- that is "Mages Guild in the northern Redguard-part; Fighters Guild next to city prison, southeastern Nord part; place with dragon fountain center of Redguard part; Arena roughly toward the center of the Nord part."

The layout will of course have to be changed, just like we won't use Daggerfall's city layout for Sentinel.

Even then, the old game's depiction of the cities can -- and should -- still be used as references and inspiration. As Tedders (IIRC) commented, the Temple of the One is in the Imperial City in Arena...

lb003g0676 · Post by **lb003g0676** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:33 pm

OOOh new WSG... Harke... what the heck are those thigns on top of the domes... lol. Very inventive indeed

Harke the Apostle · Post by **Harke the Apostle** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:45 pm

lb003g0676 wrote:OOOh new WSG... Harke... what the heck are those thigns on top of the domes... lol. Very inventive indeed

[url=http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=onionornamenthm2.jpg][img]http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/5606/onionornamenthm2.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Post by **Gnomey** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:51 pm

By the way, will the building materials be the same, or can they be changed? So far it looks to be ground or first floor, depending on where you live, is made of stones while the second level has wood. A common style is what I'm saying. I should have at least one contribution up later, sometime within the week.

Hemitheon · Post by **Hemitheon** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:05 pm

I like Harke's picture. The weather vane things are interesting. Maybe somewhere in the city or on top of a building there can be a statue or depiction of a ouroboros surrounding a golden star. Kinda like Satakal since the city is amid the Dragontail Mountains --just some ideas.

Harke the Apostle · Post by **Harke the Apostle** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:37 pm

Gnomey wrote:By the way, will the building materials be the same, or can they be changed? So far it looks to be ground or first floor, depending on where you live, is made of stones while the second level has wood. A common style is what I'm saying. I should have at least one contribution up later, sometime within the week.

My idea is to have the 'Nordic' style from Bruma, and our own Hammerfell style in the two parts of the city. The temple in the Nordic part is a Slavic take on the Moorish architexcture from the rest of Hammerfell.
Perhaps the modular Hammerfell architecture could have a gabled roof module so it can be applied in the colder Dragonstar Mountains?

Tyrion · Post by **Tyrion** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:25 pm

Bavaria meets Ottoman acrhitecture is what I had in mind.

lb003g0676 · Post by **lb003g0676** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:12 pm

This trehad has just dropped dead.. comon people, I ahve my piece ready, just too late to scan it

Harke the Apostle · Post by **Harke the Apostle** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:20 pm

lb003g0676 wrote:This trehad has just dropped dead.. comon people, I ahve my piece ready, just too late to scan it

I've just finished my first claim for Morrowind...

xanthier · Post by **xanthier** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 11:01 pm

I apologize that I never finished my entry for last week's WSG, RL work/family situations have been really hectic lately, so much going on right now. But I am not dropping off the map, I will try and get in a WSG entry again soon! thanks

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:45 am

A lower-class house, and quite apparent how poorly kept it is.
[url=http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/389/dragonstarbr9.jpg][img]http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/389/dragonstarbr9.th.jpg[/img][/url]
I wasn't too happy about this one, as it looked too Nordic. I'll try another style again, but with less thatch and more brick

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Sep 28, 2006 9:28 pm

I got an idea into my head: I'm thinking for the Hammerfellians (Redguards

) they have sandstonish materials and Yokudan carvings, not too elaborate, and with Nordic influence and style. I'm not sure about the Nordic side yet, but it should come to me when I draw up the plan. I have got around three days, that's still plenty but more than I'd like. I'd better get to work, then.

Harke the Apostle · Post by **Harke the Apostle** » Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:04 pm

[url=http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=signemblemsmaskso0.jpg][img]http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/8522/signemblemsmaskso0.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Two sign emblems, one for a restaurant that serves trout, the other for a shop where they sell armour. The mask is utilized in a festival.

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Sep 28, 2006 11:29 pm

I'm afraid that the link seems broken. This is according to the topic eview, I couldn't see anything at all in the thread itself...

Might just be a problem with my computor, though that wouldn't be much better.

(Edit) Here you go:

[url=http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarcyn8.jpg][img]http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8249/dragonstarcyn8.th.jpg[/img][/url]

First, the building. This would probably be the general building style of Hammerfell, with the occasional hard-core Nord or Redguard style thrown in. The wood of the cross beams are carved to resemble intricately carved snakes, and unlike the double headed snake that slithers across the roof they are flat, like carved two-by-fours. The balconies are supported by two snakes, the doorways have a snake going across their top and, though I forgot to draw it, I thought that the windows would be another snake curled into an arch with a plain window sill going from it's head to tail. As you may have noticed the biggest roof is at a triangular angle. This was intentional, to give whichever room it's over a more open feal.

You will notice, above the doorway, that there is a little circular symbol. I have drawn a close up, which shows seven silver crecents with seven starts at their meeting points. No real reason for this, it's just based on Harke's designs. However, in the middle there is an alcove which hides a snakeman, the lump in the sideview. (I couldn't draw a snakeman, so I gave up).

As for the city itself, I've just shown the layout. In my view the Redguard section is far bigger, and there are more outlying farms, but they are more of a poor rabble, while the Nord section's outlying fields are speckled by small manors and fief-like farms. I have only drawn a large temple, Yokudan, and an Imperial Fort, for keeping the peace, as long as enough troops are stationed there, due to lack of space, and you will no doubt notice that the writing is tiny. So I'll just say that general placement is the same as the "tetris" version of Dragonstar. I'm thinking that the sub-mayor-or-whoever-looks-after-the-buisness-in-the-Nord-District would have a very large property and a nice big 'country' manor, but obviously that will not be my decision.

Finally, the signs. Yes, they are appropriate, for how better to judge the mood of a city than by it's tavern signs? For the Nords we have the Red Bear, should hint at blood being the red, the Warriors Charge, both astronomical nod and literal meaning, and finally, the "Golden Tankard", because the Nords, though wishing and preparing for a battle, are not obsessed with it. The Redguards however: Crown and Sword, refering to Hunding and his last appearance, "Black Diagna", (not meant in a racist way, rather "black" like "Black Douglas"), and Sakatal's Wake, a referance to Sakatal's destroying one world and making another, suggesting that Skyrim will be the first to go down. Or something like that. And the three yellow dots represent the birthsigns of the Warrior, the Mage and Thief.

I believe that's all.

saithan · Post by **saithan** » Fri Sep 29, 2006 6:59 am

[url=http://img224.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nore1by2.jpg][img]http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/7291/nore1by2.th.jpg[/img][/url]
simple Inn or well to do home. steep roofing to avoid snow weightmid section fireplace for even distribution of heat.

I'll later make an more intricate version with designs for the gabel and sofet.

lb003g0676 · Post by **lb003g0676** » Sat Sep 30, 2006 2:40 pm

It looks great, but that for me is too Nordically influenced. There is going to be lots of cultures effecting this town. Imperial with new buildings, Redgaurd and Nordic. Not just one, but It really would be an awesome design, the building itself would be a sight to see in the game, don't you think?

I was gonna draw a scene of atmospheric like usual, but it turned into a design for Dragonstar armour, I was gonna colour it in, only to portray that there was water vapour coming from his mouth where it was so cold.

[url=http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstararmourip4.jpg][img]http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/4927/dragonstararmourip4.th.jpg[/img][/url]

And while posting this, i coloured it an put across what i had wanted.

[url=http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstararmourcopyhq4.jpg][img]http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/8728/dragonstararmourcopyhq4.th.jpg[/img][/url]
EDIT:
[url=http://img360.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstararmourcopycolourcopyea1.jpg][img]http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/3690/dragonstararmourcopycolourcopyea1.th.jpg[/img][/url]

And an unusual design for the actual architecture. Once it was finished I could see it was WAY too morrowindish. But I wonder where a bit of thatching over the top of them would make it looks better? Kinda a cross between Zimbabwean mud hut which is quite Redgaurdy, and yet the thatch can also resemble bits of Nordic architecture. I'll see.

[url=http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dragonstarcityzt3.jpg][img]http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2869/dragonstarcityzt3.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Sep 30, 2006 4:32 pm

The picture that you uploaded looks really nice; I could imagine that being a pass village or maybe even Dragon gate, but could you try to find a way to increase the size of he buildings? For Dragonstar I'd think that they would have much bigger huts. The idea that I'd like is a general syle, like what I have, a ixture of the best of both styles, and using the same materials, and then the Nords would have a scattering of true Nordic buildings and Redguards would have a couple of huts like yours. (I especially like the temple, or whatever the large building is at the upper right of your pic.)

Anyway, there is a hut that is darker than the rest. I believe the caption is "This hut has red dye in it's pine-based plaster." I really like the idea, but what of purpose would that house be?

lb003g0676 · Post by **lb003g0676** » Sat Sep 30, 2006 5:05 pm

I was gonna colour this picture and the houses could be dyed different colours, some blue some purple some red, some plain. Or perhaps this could be a special hut. Like for a priest to live. I wanted everything on a tiny mountain village scale, but that probably, no wait That IS unreasonable. It's a huge town i expect, so never mind, it's architectural stuff

Yes, I guess the buildings are too small, and actually you are probably right that the cultural influence rather than merged are mixed, so some houses like this, some like that.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Sep 30, 2006 5:20 pm

Personally I think the single, red (I think red would really be the only fitting colour) hut-house is best. I suggest it's use for, as you said, priests quarters. The temple and sort-of-mayor's house should, I think, not have dyed wall, and should be very large. However, that's getting rather specific.

Anyway, I might work on a more detailed map of Dragonstar, showing the houses.

Lutemoth · Post by **Lutemoth** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 6:09 pm

Once again, We come to an end result, and I'm quite pleased with the variety our artists have accomplished! Stay tuned for a new WSG, folks!