q1-70-Imp

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:04 pm

Claim type: Quest
Claim ID: TR_q1-70-Imp (#1258)
Faction: Imperial
Parent claim: TR_1-37-Tel (#61)
Claimed by: Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Status: Approved (Progress: 100%)
Location: (4020, 1473)
Files: TR_q1-70-Imp_Bloodthirsty Crustacean_1.esp

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Mages Guild on map1

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:14 pm

I wouldn't mind having a go at this, as I have discussed with Groza and Lud.

Anyway, the plan is (if I do it) to stick to the plan.

Which is this: Mages Guild

1. Banviris needs some black roses. Three, to be exact. He tells you there are some rosebushes in the Palace Foyer that he has permission to pick from; just don't take the one in the vase.

2. Now Banviris needs some Star's Eyes; three again. He warns you that though they may look harmless, the eyestar can be very dangerous. He's pretty sure he saw some eyestars near the docks (I will add some more eyestars near the docks as there is currently only one.)

3. Banviris tells you that Viccia Hateria, of Bal Oyra, has gone missing. The guild guide in Bal Oyra, Hessei-Lig, knows more. Hessei-Lig tells you that Viccia Hateria had hoped to become a member of the mages guild, but didn't have a lot of magical ability, and so he had been training her in alteration magic. She hasn't come for lessons in a while, and when he sent someone to investigate, they reported that Viccia Hateria was not there, and Hessei-Lig is afraid some spell may have gone wrong. He wants you to investigate. When you arrive at Viccia Hateria's home, at first glance it is exactly as described. She's not there. The observant player will find her, however, by looking *up.* Apparently she had been mixing a levitation and a feather spell, and something went wrong, and now she's stuck at the ceiling (by means of a collision wall). Talk to any mages guild member and he or she will suggest that if feather got her up there, burden might bring her down. Either that or dispel. Casting either on her will work.

4a. Prerequisite, has not done TG quest 6. Banviris tells you that one of the mages in the guild happened across a herne, and was able to soultrap it. The guild has since determined that the herne had been summoned, and are trying to examine the soul to determine exactly how the summoning spell works, as to their knowledge nobody had ever been able to summon a herne before. Banviris wants you to take the herne soul to Absolon at the Firewatch Library (Lecture Hall) as he has done a lot of research on summoned creatures and may be better able to determine how it was summoned.

4b. Prerequisite, completed TG quest 6. Banviris tells you that someone in the Thieves Guild has stolen a herne's soul from them (presumably not knowing that it was you.) The herne's soul is very important because the guild has been trying to study it and determine how it was summoned. Now, they just want you to find out what happened to it. Banviris teaches you the Charming Touch spell, as that may be useful when trying to coax the information out of the thieves at the Howling Noose. If you can get Silniel's disposition up high enough, she'll tell you that Eldale was the one who hired the guild to steal the herne soul, and it is now in her possession. If you somehow manage to bring the soul back, you will be instructed to bring it to Absolon, but just telling Banviris that Eldale has it will earn you a smaller reward.

5. Banviris has asked you to retrieve the Ring of Ineptitude. It's a ring with an enchantment to damage luck and damage agility on target. You can find it in Varyon Ancestral Tomb, to which he will give you directions from Ranyon-Ruhn.

6. Banviris asks you to kill a necromancer named Zaritan Renyl. Zaritan Renyl can be found in the cave Sagea. I'll have to weaken him a bit because he's currently level 35 (What's the deal with TR modders thinking necromancers have to be uber? The weaker ones are surrounded by bandits, which I'm not sure makes much sense.)

7. There have been reports of Thieves Guild activities against the Mages Guild. A wood elf named Arrell, for example, was spotted skulking near the guild here in Firewatch. Banviris wants you to send the Thieves Guild a message that the Mages Guild will not tolerate this sort of activity. He wants you to visit Arrell and use the Ring of Ineptitude on her (but don't kill her). Not only will this send the appropriate message, it will also render Arrell virtually helpless in her ability to steal, protecting the mages from her skulking in the future.

And here are the proposed changes that Groza had suggested: Right, so here are the changes and a few things to watch out for:
-Don't use the necromancer in Sagea. Lud suggested Middanecne instead, or find one on your own. If you find absolutely nothing suitable you can talk to Lud about having a new interior made.
-Starcrunch is absolutely right that it doesn't make sense for... I don't remember her name, but the levitating girl in Bal Oyra, not to call out when you enter. The updated backstory is that Hessei-Lig knows something's wrong, but the guard he sent to check on it couldn't clearly explain the situation, and because he is on duty he hasn't been able to check it out on his own.
-During the same quest, I've discovered that it is impossible to cast spells through invisible collision walls. However, if you enable the collision wall, teleport her above it and then disable it, she should stay up there due to some glitch in the engine. You'll probably have to do that every time you enter the interior, including reloads (I'm not sure how to make it work on reloads). Because of the bug I mentioned, I think the best way to actually get her to come *down* is by toggling clipping twice. There is a "fall" command but I don't know if it works, and especially with the rafters so close together she might get stuck.
-Check the dialogue for "someone in particular" because I think it lists someone other than Banviris as the mages guild steward; change that if needed.
-I've attached my copy of the Thieves Guild line; it may help to have it loaded while you mod so you can use the journal topic about the Herne's soul when you get to it. If you do the part of the quest where you have to talk to Silniel about what happened to the soul, remember two things when writing her dialogue: Stick to the sarcastic style I developed for her, and remember that *you* stole the Herne's soul in the first place. Also, Hermalian already has the herne's soul in her inventory, so don't add it again.

Sorry for the long-winded post, and feel free to fill me in on anything else I should know/do!

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Thu Mar 22, 2007 3:16 pm

Whoa! That was strange. I assume Lud's auto-claimed this for me. Not that it's a problem, I was just slightly spooked to see the thread vanish from Quest Design.

Anway, I'll get to work ASAP.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 10:10 am

Heh, when i was pressing the reply button, my interweb went and died on me. Sorry about that.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:01 pm

Just a quick question before I get started, is it essential that Banviris be Mages Guild Head? Because there's a load of dialogue that says that Gindaman is.

If the change is very important, I'll willingly change the dialogue, but I'd like to know the reasoning so I'm not doing all these changes on some 'crazy whim'. (No offense intended)

My main problem is that Gindaman far outranks Banviris. Of course, if this is a "Ranis Athris->Ajira style" arrangement, then I'll leave the dialogue, but make Gindaman point you to Banviris when you ask for duties.

EDIT: Would it be acceptable if I set up such an arrangement for the Firewatch guild, with the last three quests being given by Gindaman? If I do that, I'll make the "Herne soul" quest his first (with some rearragement of quest order as necessary), as that's 'important Guild business'.

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:28 pm

I did not realize there was a higher-ranking member than Banviris. I guess I just wasn't paying attention. Please correct it

If you want to have a two-questgiver scenario that's fine with me... anyone else want to weigh in?
Edit: Lud is away for the weekend; if you want his input I recommend you do the later quests first as those will certainly be Gindaman. And changing the order of the quests is easy, so put them in any order you prefer, and if for whatever reason it doesn't work, they're easy to move.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 23, 2007 5:01 pm

Okay, thanks for the info.

One other question: do I include faction joining/advancement dialogue in this .esp, or is that added in later?

I know I didn't with my Mouth quests.

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 5:58 pm

For the thieves guild I included the dialogue for joining, but it was almost exactly the same as Vv. Advancement is a little iffier because the conditions for advancement are not yet set-- and shouldn't be, as far as I know. I'd say don't worry about advancement for now, but make a note of it. Also, it would not be a bad idea to include some sort of dialogue catering to players who have joined the Vv guild but not the mainland one (I put it under "jobs")

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 23, 2007 6:04 pm

Okay, so joining dialogue, but not advancement?

EDIT: And in terms of Vvardenfell compatability, I have made it so that once the PC is a Conjurer in the VMG (if he is not a member of the Mainland MG), he gets insta-promoted by Gindaman to Conjurer in the Mainland MG.

The same occurs if you ask to "join the Mages Guild", and at any time if the player reaches Conjurer rank in the VMG, then a "promotion" option is allowed that also does the same thing.

However, I realise this a major thing, so I would appreciate as much input as possible as to what should happen here, and feel free to scrap my current system.

Starcrunch · Post by **Starcrunch** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 7:16 pm

I'd probably wait on deciding how much is granted based on Vv level in the guild. It's likely to be lower than a 1:1 correspondence (it certainly that way for House Telvanni). We haven't talked about it enough as far as I know. For now don't worry about it but we may need to change it.

-Starcrunch

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:07 pm

Absolutely. When I get finished with this lot, I'll make a note of any places where I have put in anything regarding faction-relations, just for easy fixing later.

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:21 pm

Yeah, I was just talking about dialogue really. I have a dialogue entry under jobs where if you've joined the Vv guild but not the mainland one, Silniel says "Look, I don't care who you know on Vvardenfell, if you want to operate here you have to join our Mainland branch." Nothing related to ranks, just a matter of letting the player know that it's a different faction.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Sat Mar 24, 2007 10:37 am

On Quest 7, how would I go about checking whether the Ring of Ineptitude has been used on Arrell?

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Sat Mar 24, 2007 12:20 pm

Put a script on Arrell to check for the spell effects. It's unlikely that the player would put the right combination of effects on Arrell by any other method.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 7:37 pm

Bloodthirsty Crustacean wrote:Okay, so joining dialogue, but not advancement?

EDIT: And in terms of Vvardenfell compatability, I have made it so that once the PC is a Conjurer in the VMG (if he is not a member of the Mainland MG), he gets insta-promoted by Gindaman to Conjurer in the Mainland MG.

The same occurs if you ask to "join the Mages Guild", and at any time if the player reaches Conjurer rank in the VMG, then a "promotion" option is allowed that also does the same thing.

However, I realise this a major thing, so I would appreciate as much input as possible as to what should happen here, and feel free to scrap my current system.

We'll have to put in a standardised script to do this for all the factions, but I definitely think that we need to have a lower "exchange rate than 1:1.
Best to just leave out the advancement and stuff for handling the player's Vvardenfell rank.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Wed Mar 28, 2007 2:14 pm

Right, thanks for clearing that up Lud. That takes a lot of worry off of me!

Final question: do I have permission for a Ranis Athris-Ajira style relationship between Gindaman and Banviris?

Once I know, then this should be finished up by the end of the week.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:06 pm

Go for it

Looking forward to seeing these merged.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:27 pm

Okay, slightly underestimated myself.

I have now done all the quests, and am going to begin personal testing. Should be finished by tomorrow.

And thanks for the encouragement, Lud!

EDIT: As you would expect, I'm having a few problems with Viccia Hateria's scripting. Here is the suspect script:

Code: Select all

Begin TR_m1_q_MGVicciaScript
; This short script is there to allow dialogue to be filtered on the TR_Map local variable, 
; allowing for regional topics such as "Morrowind Lore" or "Geographic Regions" to be
; appropriate to the location the NPC is.

short TR_Map
short control
short doonce
short freed

if ( GetJournalIndex TR_m1_MG_3 >= 10 )
	if ( GetJournalIndex TR_m1_MG_3 < 50 )
		AddSpell TR_m1_q_MG3_LevAb
		PositionCell 4244, 3813, 15660, 270, "Bal Oyra, Viccia Hateria's Home"
			if ( doonce == 0 )
				ForceGreeting
				set doonce to 1
			endif
	endif
endif

If ( GetJournalIndex TR_m1_MG_3 == 40 )
	If ( GetEffect sDispel == 1 )
		RemoveSpell TR_m1_q_MG3_LevAb
		set freed to 1
	Endif
Endif
	

if ( TR_Map == 1 )
	return
endif

set TR_Map to 1

End

The bit that appears to be actually giving the error is the "If GetJournalIndex TR_m1_MG_3 == 40" bit, because the rest appears to work. In that block, however, I get a "left eval" error, whatever that means.

Any help appreciated.

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:22 pm

Left eval always confuses me, but a bit of googling seems to indicate that it results from something being wrong on the left side of an ->
Seeing as your script has no -> in it, I'm guessing one of those lines needs one. Try putting it in the geteffect line, i.e. "if ( TR_m1_Viccia_Hateria -> GetEffect sDispel == 1 )" I'm not near the CS right now so I can't test that, but if it's not that, try one of the other lines.

Starcrunch · Post by **Starcrunch** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:45 pm

GetEffect is being passed the wrong argument, it's sEffectDispel not sDispel.

-Starcrunch

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:51 pm

That's gotta be it, Starcrunch. Thanks for pointing that out.

Okay, I'll just test this now...

EDIT: Yep, that worked. Thanks again, guys!

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:24 pm

I wondered about that... I actually typed sEffectDispel automatically when I wrote the line in my previous post, but I edited it when I looked at BC's code again.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Thu Mar 29, 2007 2:05 pm

Okay, last couple of bugs here:

Number 1: Because I got floaty girl stuck to the ceiling via a levitate ability, I assumed that the removal of that ability (as you can see from my script) would send her falling down. She does come down, but instead of falling, she just 'snaps' to the ground. Any way around this?

Number 2: For the last quest (Thieves Guild incursions), is there any way I can use GetSpellEffects (or whatever that command is) to test for enchantments being cast on an actor, or do I just have to assume that if she's got both effects (damage agility, damage luck) on her, they are from the RoI?

Just out of interest, is there any way to check whether the PC has used a "cast on self" enchantment?

Starcrunch · Post by **Starcrunch** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:19 pm

Number 1: Groza, worked on issues with the levitating girl so I'll leave this one for him

.

Number 2: Just use "geteffect" because if the PC uses his own spells to mimic the effects of the ring, the quest should play out the same.
If you want to try to make it exactly specific for the ring, you could try calling the ID for your enchantment in a GetSpellEffects function. I'm not sure it will work as I've never used the function and their is no info in MWSD that suggests whether it will work or not.

-Starcrunch

groza528 · Post by **groza528** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:29 pm

1) I don't know that you're going to get much better than that, really. Even if you did manage to get her to fall I think you might have trouble with her getting caught in the rafters. If you're feeling ambitious you could put in a global script that would lower her little by littleand then eventually take off the levitate effect when she hits the ground-- or you could only drop her when she's not in the PC's line of sight (maybe with an additional piece of dialogue where she asks you to do something that will cause you to turn away. "Oh no, it didn't work. And all the floating is making me a little tired, would you mind grabbing my pillow for me?" [player turns away] "Oh, never mind. It looks like it just took a little while for the effect to occur."
If worse comes to worse, I don't think a "snap-to-ground" effect is the end of the world.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:39 pm

Well, I'm still ironing out small bugs here and there, so hopefully this should be done by tomorrow.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:59 pm

Okay, just wrapping up now. Do I have permission to fix Hessei-Lig's seemingly buggy Service Refusal dialogue? Currently it means he refuses to transport anyone, regardless of faction, whilst his control is 0.

This seems wrong to me, so could I tweak this so that he gets a proper script (that sets the control to 1 once the player reaches an appropriate rank in the IL) and he always lets Mages' Guild members travel?

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 3:08 pm

Go for it

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:01 pm

HI STRYKER!1!!

Okay, sorry about this. Final scripting woes before I'm finished are here. Namely: the Thieves Guild gal.

Code: Select all

Begin TR_m1_q_Arrell
; This short script is there to allow dialogue to be filtered on the TR_Map local variable, 
; allowing for regional topics such as "Morrowind Lore" or "Geographic Regions" to be
; appropriate to the location the NPC is.

short TR_Map
short control
short hit
short doonce
short checkonce
short myluck
short myagility

if ( TR_Map != 1 )
	set TR_Map to 1
endif

if ( GetJournalIndex TR_m1_MG_7 != 10 )
	return
endif

if ( checkonce == 0 )
	set myluck to GetLuck
	set myagility to GetAgility
	set checkonce to 1
endif

if ( myluck > GetLuck )
	if ( myagility > GetAgility )
	if ( doonce == 0 )
		Journal TR_m1_MG_7 20
		set hit to 1
		set doonce to 1
		ForceGreeting
	endif
	endif
endif

End

Can you possibly tell me why that doesn't work?

Starcrunch · Post by **Starcrunch** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:12 pm

In what way is it broken?

Does it fail to function as you hoped, or is it an error message? It's not obvious that there is anything wrong that would generate an error, and if it is a general failure to function can you describe what it is supposed to do.

-Starcrunch

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:21 pm

Okay. What is happening is that the final block fails to process. When I use the Ring of Ineptitude on Arrell, she just attacks me. I get no journal update or greeting, and using "show hit" yields a result of 0, showing that none of that result block happened.

Sorry for the prior vagueness. I was hoping it would be an easily spotted error like my previous.

Starcrunch · Post by **Starcrunch** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:30 pm

Check the variables myluck and myagility. What kind of enchantment is on the ring? Also click on the NPC and use GetLuck and GetAgility by console command to determine the results after hitting her with the ring. That will probably tell you that GetLuck and GetAgility are returning their starting values even after applying the enchantment. The other possibility is that some other code is adding a journal entry with an index greater than 10.

I suggest using GetEffect in place of ability checks to solve this problem.

-Starcrunch

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:38 pm

The problem with GetEffect is that it only works with "Damage Attribute" not specifically "Damage Luck" etc.

Either way, it's fixed, a stupid blunder that came from not updating scripts correctly after a change of quest name.

Thanks for the help anyway, Starcrunch.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:43 pm

Consider it done.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:52 pm

Any reason this hasn't moved to finished yet? Is there something I should've done?

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:38 pm

Will merge it when I get a chance.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:31 pm

Just thinking, I do not believe I have given a list of things that need to be placed by the mergers. These are:

More eyestars in the Firewatch Docks (I'd say another five)

Ring of Ineptitude in Varyon Ancestral Tomb

I believe that that is all.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Mon May 21, 2007 11:04 am

merged

theviking · Post by **theviking** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:04 pm

Approving. Yay, first questline! We still have to make the dialogue to join and advance in it, I'll try to remember that.