n8-60-Cro

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:18 am

requesting permission to mark territory

all approved/reviwed design and concept for the market modulars will get made. Stalls will be top priority: after the lc_modulars are finished I would move on to finishing lc_clutter specific for the market

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:44 pm

Granted, please post progress and stuff. market stalls are definitely top priority, followed by the containers. keep polies as low as possible. your showcase wips look great!

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:13 pm

sadly, progress will be slow for a couple days: I just suffered injury to my right hand and trying to move a mouse around is excrutiating. I'll be up and running once it starts healing.

Post by **Haplo** » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:36 pm

You could try switching your mouse to the left side of the keyboard. Just a thought; I don't know if your mouse is one hand dominant or not.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 2:33 am

It doesn't hurt bad enough today! Im working fervently on the market stalls.

all uvmaps done for this market module. Its supposed to sit in front of the vendor stalls and display food. or camel parts

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=lc_market_fruitstand.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_lc_market_fruitstand.jpg[/img][/url]
facets: 634

I left space for the fruit: I'll explain that more detailed after I mesh it.

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=lc_market_foodstand_01_template.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_lc_market_foodstand_01_template.jpg[/img][/url]

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 2:43 am

Can either of you upload me some fruit from the ob cs that will be used in hammerfell? apples, grapes, and such. I don't have a working copy of oblivion so its a little hard for me to come by

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:02 am

full market wip:

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=1-1.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_1-1.jpg[/img][/url]

aro101 · Post by **aro101** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:19 pm

Freakin sweet. Upload the maxscene please. I'd love to take a look.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:37 pm

'er you go

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Fri Feb 13, 2009 10:55 pm

ive attached a couple ingredients, you dont have to make displays for all of them though (though you certainly can). ive also attached an open sack that i think would work well for the market, maybe fill it up with something other than grain.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:01 pm

thnkyou very much. the engine gets bogged down when you have barrels and baskets and bounds of ingred clutter everywhere: So I'm going to make the glass half full. Since you aren't going to be stealing the fruit: (unless you're a god) you won't be picking it up: which means there's no reason to have 12-15 apples in a barrel when you can only see 3. Its just a waste: no other rpg game does things like that! I'll make it look like its full whilst you can still interact with the objects on the top two layers if you feel like getting bashed by guards.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:25 pm

You could also set them up as flora: the player activates it and can get a lovely apple before having his head bashed in. No need for ingredients to be placed at all. That's how they did it with garlic. (Unless that's what you intended to do in the first place, in which case I'm sorry for cluttering up this thread).

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:30 pm

no, actualy thats a grand idea! I'll move in that direction:

and::::
how the hell do I import .nif files into max? I can't remember!

aro101 · Post by **aro101** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 8:55 pm

http://niftools.sourceforge.net/wiki/NifTools

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 8:59 pm

NexUmMonastica wrote:thnkyou very much. the engine gets bogged down when you have barrels and baskets and bounds of ingred clutter everywhere: So I'm going to make the glass half full. Since you aren't going to be stealing the fruit: (unless you're a god) you won't be picking it up: which means there's no reason to have 12-15 apples in a barrel when you can only see 3. Its just a waste: no other rpg game does things like that! I'll make it look like its full whilst you can still interact with the objects on the top two layers if you feel like getting bashed by guards.

not really sure what you mean here, but i think its what i mean too.

i want to create a container that looks like a bucket(or crate, or plate) of apples, so that the player can see that apples are in it, activate it and take some out. but no havok (which is what gets us lagging). exactly like garlic or those open sacks of grain.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 9:11 pm

Not really. We have the same idea in mind, and Nex seems to too now, but I think that, when he wrote the post you quoted, Nex intended to place a static dummy mesh of the ingredients which the player can't interact with with a few apple ingredients placed on top. That's the impression I got anyway. Just (making an attempt at) clarifying things.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 9:15 pm

that could (and would) be done by the modder themselves, not by the modeler.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 9:26 pm

Well, yes, it would. If we were to go Nex's original way he'd just model the same thing but make it slightly shallower, and it would be added to OoT as a static object, and then a modder would place it and would cover it with the ingredient version. That's as opposed to creating the less shallow version, adding it to OoT as flora, like the hanging garlic "plant", and having the modder either place it as is or add a few ingredients to make it look more interesting or who knows why, which is what I think we're all agreeing to go with now.

Jedak · Post by **Jedak** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:29 am

I love you Nex

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:36 am

ok ok gnomey gets my idea the best, but we're all on the same page.

What we all have to avoid in meshing is polys that are not visible to the player. If the bottom of the apple is not visible: and there is a >1% chance you will ever see that part of the apple then flippin' get rid of it. If all you see are 11 tris then get rid of the rest. Since its going to be a STATIC CONTAINER that resembles a PILE of fruit: then all you need is the side the player sees! that will cut 70% of polys out of every open container which could knock down about 10,000-12,000 polys across the immediate market area. Not to mention the Havok laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaggg

I'm off to celebrate VD day with my girl so expect some more progress on monday.

<3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3

[edited]
and thnx aro for the link!

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:17 pm

thats exactly what i meant

enjoy your VD!

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 1:43 am

Since it weighs heavily upon game performance in the market; I went ahead and violated this apple:

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=appleexample.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_appleexample.jpg[/img][/url]

I took 142 polys out of the apple and from 3 feet you couldn't tell the difference unless you knew what to look for.
14 Bethsuck apples: 5572 tris
14 Nex apples : 3584 tris

If someone could upload the coresponding textures for the fruit that would be handy: I need to make difefrent fruits for the marketplace as well.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:26 pm

Any updates?

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:00 pm

i just emailed him and hopefully he will get back in a week, if not this claims gets revoked

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:50 am

IM BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACK
finaly got internet AND a little free time.
Hope to post some progress this week

:EDITED: sry, didn't want to double post:

what is the size of the textures in tesIV? I know it needs to be /4 for the .dds file to be made.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 1:43 pm

awesome to see you back, we really need ya

most textures are 512*512. things that are really high detail can go up to 1024, anything above that is just a waste of resources imo. your market looks like it could use vanilla and existing OoT textures for the most part and save us some space in the download.

you still need to fruit textures right? ill get those up shortly.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 4:58 pm

well then why don't I fix them? I can make a 512x512 that contains possibly every fruit: its not like you're ever face to face with an apple right?

and I'm not sure what you mean by vanilla textures, but I will break this market up into the proper modules (already started) and try to make it into 1 or in the worst case 2 1024's. If i needed an extra texture then I could just go with a 512 and put all the small things in it.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 5:41 pm

vanilla means from the original game. what i mean is that the wood posts on the stand could easily be maped to use a texture already in the game, meaning that we dont have to include another texture in OoT. the fabric hanging on top and from the sides could be another texture (possibly the same as the MC overhangs?), and the rope a third. each stall should be separated by material and use different textures instead of cramming all pieces (wood posts, ropes, fabric, peppers, etc.) into one texture.

as for the fruit, they are fine as it is i think, since the textures are already in the game.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 7:30 pm

but shouldn't the fruit in HF be a little different? like red apples instead of the existing ones, or purple grapes instead of red. You should really consider using fresh fruit for such a huge marketplace since the existing meshes in OB take tons of processor speed to render when in large groups. Just re-meshing the existing meshes and re-mapping the textures would open up a huge window of possibility. If you are still working around the same concepts Im sure there is going to be fruit-clutter EVERYWHERE

Bananas and camels. That's what I'm all about here.

:EDITED: and yes, I will see what textures I can pull form the game to save space, but i was under the impression that hammerfell needed to look completely different than Cyrodill. wouldn't pulling textures from OB take the contrast out of it? of course if its like wood boards I see no problem, but Cyrodill hanging cloth and baskets and jars would probably look to out of place

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:08 pm

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/?action=view&current=apple_001example.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/th_apple_001example.jpg[/img][/url]

ok, I didn't waste too much time but as you know I always have to argue with an example.

Now I'm back to working on the modules, specificaly the wod food carts/stalls.

::EDITED (im on an edit spree i guess)::
244 tris including all nif/havok
174 actual tris in the apple, almost half of beth's apple. I didn't quite mean to cut that much but i really saw NO reason for so many polys in the top and stem.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:39 pm

Stall texturing WIP: texture is not completed just laying proper uvw's.

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/?action=view&current=stallexample_001.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/th_stallexample_001.jpg[/img][/url]

Jelle · Post by **Jelle** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:30 pm

Looking great dude. I love your work on this claim so far, can't wait for some more textured pieces.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:21 pm

imo its a bit unrealistic when you cross the border and suddenly all your apples are red, when they were yellow before. now, that being said, im all for a couple apples in a pile being red and some green for added variety or something (can probably be achieved through vertex shading even) but i dont think that every apple should automatically look different. im all for bananas, and for gourds and papayas too, new stuff is always nice

Lighter than Some has a whole series of food concepts which i think i linked, but if i did not they are in his thread. if youre going to model new fruits make sure to include havok.

as for textures: yes, agreed. however, stuff like rope really doesnt matter all that much. the generic, little seen materials can be left for vanilla textures, while the cool raga stuff, like clay, cloth, beads, etc, will be unique and identifying of the province. i was really suggesting that you use textures from our pack (though i wasnt being really clear). there are several MC wood textures and one LC wood texture that i think would go nicely, and you can also take a look at some of the other stuff we use and see where you can fit that in. making a whole new set of wood just for this will break realism a bit i think: the crates use one type of wood, the stall another, and the house supports yet another one - in a province with very limited wood this doesnt make very much sense (it also doesnt help to have the cities look cohesive).

on the same topic, im not fond of some of the textures that are currently in the archive. say you make a new texture for the cloth, we could use it for the overhangs in OoT already to help with the cohesion of the place. if you need to make new textures go ahead, and i'll try to work them into other models later on

the models are looking good, hope this post makes some sense

i cant wait to play with all this stuff in game

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 11:52 pm

yes it makes sense and i have gourds of opinions to spew back but i'll hold off on that: with the whole texture thing I think we're on the same page but:

GOURDDAMNIT, I DON'T HAVE A COPY OF OBLIVION XD

I need the entire OoT of tesIV and if someone can upload the parts pertinent to my claims as I go I would love you long time with many gourds.

gourds.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:02 am

OoT is available [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=19527]here[/url]

see if you can find something you like in there, i'll upload a few vanilla textures for your consideration tomorrow.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:34 am

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/?action=view&current=mrkt_foodstand_example.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/th_mrkt_foodstand_example.jpg[/img][/url]

final wip for one of three similar modules , awaiting approval and nif/havok.

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:09 am

No, lady N I need the OoT of tesIV not just the OoT of TR. There is extremely little that I could use in the TR file for the new meshes. Is there someqhere I can get the .dat or .cab file for OB's library?

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:08 am

all 4 modules, one set of textures:

module 1
[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=fs_1.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_fs_1.jpg[/img][/url]

module 2
[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=fs_2.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_fs_2.jpg[/img][/url]

module 3
[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=fs_3.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_fs_3.jpg[/img][/url]

module 4
[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=fs_4.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_fs_4.jpg[/img][/url]

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:47 pm

Pot # 1. UVW, Maps, Mesh, and Scene

[url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=lcpot1b.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_lcpot1b.jpg[/img][/url][url=http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/?action=view&current=lcpot1a.jpg][img]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/solobeck/TR/th_lcpot1a.jpg[/img][/url]

NexUmMonastica · Post by **NexUmMonastica** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:00 pm

:EDITED: .rar download removed: more updated version avaliable