Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 *IMO*

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:24 am

This thread is intended to discuss what we think is currently wrong, without being technically a bug, with the current release. Therefore, it's kinda subjective, and thus open to debate.

Data:
- The Baker NPC class needs to have skills and related stuff that makes sense for such a class, instead of being ÃƒÂ¼ber warriors. I'd model them on the Publicans, with Alchemy (as a rough equivalent of cooking) instead of Security. So: Personality/Intelligence, Stealth, primaries: Alchemy/Speechcraft/Mercantile/Sneak/Light Armor/Security, secondaries: Block/Blunt Weapon/Hand to Hand/Medium Armor/Spear.

Map1:
-Milia Norethi, her dialogue and her boat need to be excised from Port Telvannis. Beside, if you ask her about Port Telvannis, she'll tell you herself that the docking fees for boat here are insanely high, because this is what all shipmasters say, because there wasn't any shipmaster here to begin with so I don't know why she was added later in contradiction of everything. Further, she connects to Helnim. Hello? This doesn't make sense at all! She'd have to go all the way around the Dolmolag and Neidweisra peninsulae. PT is in the Padomaic Ocean, Helnim is in the Inner Sea. She makes about as much sense as a ship between Vos and Hla Oad.
And finally she's completely unneeded because there are already two therionauts at PT who have room free for more destinations in map2 and 3, so adding a shipmaster here is stupid.
-There is no inn, tavern or hotel at all in Port Telvannis. If possible, something should be done in the Avenue, perhaps in a new "basement wing", so that people have a place to sleep.

Map2:
-Helnim needs a mages guild relay. It doesn't need to be bigger than a closet. It should link to and be linked from Firewatch and Bal Oyra.
-Most of our map1 travel services have not been expanded for Map2, this needs to change. None of our Map1 or Map2 travel services use all of their four slots. We've got five strider ports, that mean that each could link to the other four. I can understand wanting to leave room for Map3 locations as well, but that excuse is flimsy for Map1 travel services because I don't expect to see a Bal Oyra-Almalexia direct line. (While travel lines should usually be two-way, one-way lines are acceptable if they're not the norm.)

Post by **Haplo** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:17 am

A Mages Guild presence needs to be added in one of the caves outside of Helnim (if there isn't a cave, add one?), since they got run out of the town by the Telvanni presence.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:53 am

duuuuude

not that youre wrong

but im just staring at all the words in your post like dolmolag and therionaut

Chin Music · Post by **Chin Music** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:29 am

I kind of always thought that Port Telvannis should have a Morag Tong guildhall. The principle for joining is the same as it was in the vanilla game, so you wouldn't be able to join at the guildhall, and you wouldn't even necessarily have to give them quests. I just thought it would make more sense.

Oh and I guess an inn there too would probably also be good.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:48 am

what the fuck is with the slaves on the docks that doesnt really make sense to me

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:44 am

Port Telvannis really needs a place to sleep. And perhaps a house for the Telvanni members (which works for anyone in Vanilla Telvanni and TR Telvanni)

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:57 pm

Haplo wrote:A Mages Guild presence needs to be added in one of the caves outside of Helnim (if there isn't a cave, add one?), since they got run out of the town by the Telvanni presence.

That's dumb. If the Telvanni are being hostile, would they rather go out in the wilderness where they can be slaughtered by a bunch of marauders, or in the basement of the Helnim Hall where they're protected by the Imperial Legion? If it's a question of economic competition, the Mages Guild has a monopoly anyway, and I don't see how getting out of the town would help.

Xui'al · Post by **Xui'al** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:48 pm

Gez wrote: Map2:
-Helnim needs a mages guild relay.

TF harassed me about getting it done, and [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=249674]now you aren't going to use it?[/url] It's tiny hole in the wall. There isn't anything there except a crappy alchemist and a guild guide.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:55 pm

We are using the mages guild relay, I don't know how everyone forgot about it.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:01 pm

Wasn't "Mephalain Mountains" a typo for "Mephalian Mountains" or maybe "Mephalan Mountains"? Do we keep it that way or do we change it?

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:04 pm

I prefer the spelling "Mephalan", it sounds most natural.

Post by **Haplo** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:52 pm

Mephalain was just the way we turned Mephala into a descriptor. If we change it we need to make sure we catch all instances of it. Mephalan would probably be the alternative.

Xui'al · Post by **Xui'al** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:08 pm

Thrignar Fraxix wrote:We are using the mages guild relay, I don't know how everyone forgot about it.

Ah. As I have yet to travel to Helnim, I had no idea if it was being used or not.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:19 pm

I don't know if it is there actually, if it isn't it will be placed there.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:21 pm

It's not used currently.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:21 pm

Will we be releasing a new version of Map 2 before the quested beta goes out or not?

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:19 am

Mephalan mountains is stupid anyway with Boethian mountains right next door. who thought that was a good idea?

oh yeah prometheus or rodan or someone.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:44 am

The Map2 map scrolls (TR_sc_map2**) are named "Sacred Lands"... While they do have Necrom because they were made before map split, the name is inappropriate. Each should have its own name, referring to the main city on that part of the map.
map2nw.dds refers to Darconis, it should be Helnim now.

TR_sc_map2half should be TR_sc_map3half BTW.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:41 pm

Oh, and in the ingredients, "Troll fat" should be "Troll Fat".

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Feb 27, 2009 5:57 pm

Gez wrote: Map2:
-Helnim needs a mages guild relay. It doesn't need to be bigger than a closet. It should link to and be linked from Firewatch and Bal Oyra.
-Most of our map1 travel services have not been expanded for Map2, this needs to change. None of our Map1 or Map2 travel services use all of their four slots. We've got five strider ports, that mean that each could link to the other four. I can understand wanting to leave room for Map3 locations as well, but that excuse is flimsy for Map1 travel services because I don't expect to see a Bal Oyra-Almalexia direct line. (While travel lines should usually be two-way, one-way lines are acceptable if they're not the norm.)

Where do you think's missing? I set them up, because no one else was willing, and I added in all the logical points of connection.

The only things that I didn't do are, for instance, Tel Muthada -> Bal Oyra, or Alt Bosara -> Gah Sadrith, because the distances were insane, and there were suitable waystations (TM->RR->BO ; AB->Ll->GS etc.)

Post by **Swiftoak** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:15 pm

The bounding boxes of Necrom's temple need to be fixed.

I know I haven't had any time to work on Necrom, but I still feel it's essential.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 11:29 pm

Jelle had fixed them. No idea if he ever uploaded them.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:19 am

The BookArt maps are a disaster, aren't they? Firewatch_AA01 still shows the Bridge to Vvardenfell. Names such as Gah Ouadaruhn or Darconis are still around. On Baloyra_AA01, Bahrammu is called Abaelun Mine! For fuck's sake, [url=http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Abaelun_Mine]Abaelun Mine[/url] is a Bethesda interior that's in the West Gash!

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:13 am

They also aren't very necessary anymore. As I understand it there are multiple ways to get around the awful map issue.

If anyone wonders why I've been so active recently, I have 3 essays due next week and I need something to help me procrastinate. :-)

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:13 am

If we have loads of time/people availiable, one thing I think Map 2 could do with is if someone went round the exteriors and fixed some of the more dodgy areas. In particular, the 'top strip of cells' of Map 2 (with Baldrahn, and that Dwemer ruin, all the way to the west side) are significantly different in style and quality to the rest of the Map.

Another thing that a really bored exteriorer could do also is expand the level of detail in TR's seas, particularly off the east coast, where theres a pretty much instant collapse in detail. Particularly noticable on the world map.

There could also do with being more islands between TR lands and Vvard on the west side.

Post by **Haplo** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:22 am

I guess I can post them here in case I accidentally delete my file. Some things needing to be done for TR_Data that I cannot do:

-Get icons for Necrom armor

-Get someone to fix the Daedric Bats (isn't some new guy doing this?

-Fix the blue glowingness of TR_ex_ind_bridge05!!! Dirty Majra... (The bridge used to connect Almalexia to the capitol of Mournhold, leading up to the Gates of Symmachus)

-TR_ex_Imp_GateSmall01 opens really fast, and has no sound.

MMMowSkwoz · Post by **MMMowSkwoz** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:18 am

Haplo wrote:-TR_ex_Imp_GateSmall01 opens really fast, and has no sound.

If you can't find a way of modifying the object, this script will do it. Just place it on TR_ex_Imp_GateSmall01 - it will work for all references (it's not location specific). It adds the same sounds as the Firewatch gates and opens at the same speed as them. It also closes automatically if you change cell and are more than 2000 game units away, but if you don't want that, I can remove it easily.

For both instances of this gate in Helnim, the landscape around the gates need to be flattened so the gates don't pass through the earth.

Edit: this has been dealt with

Post by **Haplo** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:15 pm

Thanks M3S. I'm working on a slightly updated TR_Data.esm to upload later today, and this will be included in it.

Mwgek · Post by **Mwgek** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:05 pm

Had some fun with photoshop this morning:

[url=http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/584/testlly.jpg][img]http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/584/testlly.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Added the file below. Not all the armor parts where properly named to the icons. Like the gauntlets and helmet need to be adjusted.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:21 pm

Not sure I like them all. Your greaves icon is especially jarring.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:53 am

Anybody has any idea why our Telvanni have a "Caster" rank where the Vv. branch has a "Mouth" rank? Is it deliberate or a bug?

Andres Indoril · Post by **Andres Indoril** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:09 am

So the player would not be able to become a mouth of House Telvanni the mainland.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Thu Mar 05, 2009 8:11 am

Gez wrote:Anybody has any idea why our Telvanni have a "Caster" rank where the Vv. branch has a "Mouth" rank? Is it deliberate or a bug?

[url]http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=19604[/url]

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 7:20 pm

Alright, makes sense. Moving on to another rank discrepancy, this one without any possible justification: the tenth rank of the TR Imperial Legion is currently named "Knight of Imperial Dragon", which is Engrish for "Knight of the Imperial Dragon". Please fix for next Data update.

theviking · Post by **theviking** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:28 pm

We should also begin to make a faction for the Imperial Archeological Society, there is no currently and it has to be included in TR_data. (Since it appears in several maps)
I suggest 'university' ranks for it, so you could begin as Student and end up as Dean.
For skills, mercantile should be in it, unarmored too, probably hand-to-hand. possibly security, enchant, perhaps armorer.
For attributes I was thinking about Agility and Intelligence.

Post by **Haplo** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:41 pm

So what would the ranks be?

Student
Graduate Assistant
Doctoral Student
Associate Professor
Professor
Professor with Tenure
Associate Chair
Chair
Associate Dean
Dean

Or something like that? Perhaps part-time and full-time students?

blackbird · Post by **blackbird** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:53 pm

theviking wrote:We should also begin to make a faction for the Imperial Archeological Society, there is no currently and it has to be included in TR_data. (Since it appears in several maps)
I suggest 'university' ranks for it, so you could begin as Student and end up as Dean.
For skills, mercantile should be in it, unarmored too, probably hand-to-hand. possibly security, enchant, perhaps armorer.
For attributes I was thinking about Agility and Intelligence.

Why should you give them university ranks? They are archeologists.

Local Area topic in TEl mothrivra: When I created this file I didn't know that there was a settlement called Hla Bulor. I should have looked more to map2a1. You may add a small description of Hla Bulor and rename Gah Oudaruhn to LLothanis.

The road transition between cell 34,8 and 35,7 isn't optimal. I see some texture errors (and 3 road textures).

latest rumors topic in Tel Mothrivra: "If you like reading literature, you should see The Telvanni Library north of here. And I don't mean the library in Firewatch." It should be northwest.

Some cells of the boethian mountains region are underdetailed like 34,4 and 33,4. Those cells don't have flora.

Gez · Post by **Gez** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:20 pm

blackbird wrote:Why should you give them university ranks? They are archeologists.

Okay, so I propose ranks that are more appropriate to archaeologists:
0: Pennsylvania Jones
1: Alaska Jones
2: Virginia Jones
3: California Jones
4: South Carolina Jones
5: Louisiana Jones
6: Montana Jones
7: North Dakota Jones
8: Minnesota Jones
9: Indiana Jones

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:51 pm

For shame! No way South Carolina is a higher rank than California!

MMMowSkwoz · Post by **MMMowSkwoz** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 12:01 am

I also think the university ranks sound bad - they sound too modern to my ears. A few suggestions:

Apprentice
Assistant
Coordinator
Supervisor
Fellow
Master
Archchancellor

Tamriel Rebuilt

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 *IMO*

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 *IMO*

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 *IMO*

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 *IMO*

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO

Re: Things that need to be done in Data and Map1/2 IMO