Name Dedefecation

[Why]

"Bos" actually means woodland or forest in Dutch, so for us it's triple hilarious. I was going to protest the renaming of Bosmora since I recalled it being on some map, but I looked it up and the only "Bosmora" reference I found was [url=http://www.imperial-library.info/maps/minibigmaproadslore31gv.jpg]this map[/url] which is fan-made. I'm sure most of you were aware of this, but I wasn't so I figured I'd just post it for those that didn't know. I do like Akamora, but yeah, building block. Does it hurt to have one building block'd name in that area though? Vanilla had several and as far as I know (if we get rid of Bosmora which we should) Akamora is the only one in the vicinity...

[blackbird]

Based on [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=20818]this list[/url].


Bosmoram: An old sore, but it's currently a very transparent translation of... Wood Wood.

Darnim Watch: Just cut the Watch.

I believe the name Darnim Watch became Darnim a while ago. On of the last files (m3a5) contains a cell called Darnim.

Another question: should we rename Tear? I think that Dres will be the best possible option as it's mentioned in the MW vanilla dialogue. The dialogue fom the CS: Tear: It's also called Dres since it's the home of House Dres. Too hot for me, though. It's practically in Argonia.
The only NPC who say this line is Drulene Falen a female Dunmer farmer who you will meet during the House redoran quests.

I'm pretty sure Adanorcil was aware of this, since he lives/ studies at Leuven (http://www.imperial-library.info/about/)

[RelinQ]

@TF

Got any Idea's or suggestions as to what 'Reich Parkeep' should be renamed to? I've been trying to think of an alternative name for a while now, but I cant quite place it.


@Jule

Dun Iranyon sounds a little odd, but if you were to drop the 'Dun' it might be a good name for a Dunmer stronghold aslong as its pronounced like (er-ran-yon) rather than a more american way of (I-ran-yon).

@Ada

Dondril? really? That was one of the names I actaully thought sounded on the right wavelength, It might be the inital O in the name that I like about this.

Akamora - I understand about the transparent building block thing, but I do also quite like that name, most people are used to it now and it does feel rather right, also I know a fair few have expressed their like for the name. I'd be happy to leave this as be. (same as Dondril)

Dreynim - I've always thought it would sound better without the Y, so Drenim (dren-nim) as apposed to (drey-nim)

Darnim/Darnim Watch - Out of the towns with a 'D' Name on map3, thats the one I'd recommend for change.
To me the name lacks feeling, Its sounds like someone just said 'darn' andd stuck -im on the end in a spur the moment type situation. but thats just my opinion....

As for Bosmora, no idea about it, but it does sound blocky

Eitherway as far as this goes, these are just my opinions, I have no strong urge to have anything pushed for renaming. (It's not like I decide anything anyway )

[Adanorcil]

I was going to protest the renaming of Bosmora since I recalled it being on some map, but I looked it up and the only "Bosmora" reference I found was this map which is fan-made.

If it were on an official map, that would still not be a reason not to fix it.

I do like Akamora, but yeah, building block. Does it hurt to have one building block'd name in that area though? Vanilla had several and as far as I know (if we get rid of Bosmora which we should) Akamora is the only one in the vicinity...

Of course vanilla had several building block names. They were made up for that game to begin with. I shall illustrate it with a parable.


Once upon a time some guy made a game, the two main characters of which were called Mario and Luigi. Many years later, a group of dedicated fans decided to make a homage to that game. Considering that all the main characters they had ever seen had names consisting of the syllables Ma, Ri, O, Lu, I and Gi, they decided to be consistent and named their two new characters Riogi and Malui. They were made fun of for many years.


Building block names aren't just all names composed out of multiple parts. They are just those names composed out of the same five parts you find in the original. (And that is stretchable, because both Bos and Aka really have nothing to do with the Dunmer anyway. Someone just thought this was Lore and therefore a really good idea.) What is so bad about these two is that they scream MEANINGFUL in your face, but that MEANINGFUL is lame beyond words. Even the original Dragon Glade is a terrible DnD-style name. We can really do better.

I believe the name Darnim Watch became Darnim a while ago. On of the last files (m3a5) contains a cell called Darnim.

That's fine in that case.

Another question: should we rename Tear? I think that Dres will be the best possible option as it's mentioned in the MW vanilla dialogue.

I'm personally not so terribly against it, because it still sounds like something that be an actual name rather than something meant to sound cool. I would suggest that we use Dres in dialogue as an alternative, but not the only official name.

Possible other idea: Tear is an Imperial malapropism for the full Dunmer Tyr Dres.

un Iranyon sounds a little odd, but if you were to drop the 'Dun' it might be a good name for a Dunmer stronghold

You're thinking that because Indoranyon is already one. We already made Ranyon Ruhn, so I think we should think about something else.

really? That was one of the names I actaully thought sounded on the right wavelength, It might be the inital O in the name that I like about this.

The Dunmer hardly ever used a final -il, both in proper names or in toponyms. The Altmer and Bosmer use it in proper names and even for cities (Lilandril), but it's out of place for the Dunmer.

[Scamp]

Possible other idea: Tear is an Imperial malapropism for the full Dunmer Tyr Dres

I like that idea.

You're thinking that because Indoranyon is already one. We already made Ranyon Ruhn, so I think we should think about something else.

I agree with you, there are so many possibilities regarding names, and 'Iranyon' and 'Indoranyon' sound so similar that they could easily be mixed up.

[Katze]

Not sure if this is the right thread to put this, but the Imperial village and fort in my current exterior claim needs a name. The claim is 4-14, the town is very much like a mainland version of Seyda Neen in style, and has an overlook fort on the cliffs atop it.

Screenshot: http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/9093/captureuy.jpg

[Thrignar Fraxix]

Back in the day, I seem to recall that everything in the dun akafel, akamora area was intentionally named to reference dragons. (even that tree house inn) If this is still going to be a plot point (the bit about alma doing the horizontal mambo with a dragon I mean) then I don't think we want to rename akamora (or at least leave in some sort of dragon bit)

[Aeven]

@Cathartis: Herlucua, it sounds Imperial. For some reason we give a lot of our Imperial settlements Dunmeri names, as though none were built by Imperials originally.

[Thrignar Fraxix]

I don't like that name at all

[Katze]

Herlucua doesn't sound imperial at all D:

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

Personally I half-like Akamora. I'm not too keen on Ada's replacement (for any of them actually, none of them quite ring the right bells for me).

Let's leave Tear alone please. Retcon whatever, but in-game it really has to be called Tear.

[Haplo]

Back in the day, I seem to recall that everything in the dun akafel, akamora area was intentionally named to reference dragons. (even that tree house inn) If this is still going to be a plot point (the bit about alma doing the horizontal mambo with a dragon I mean) then I don't think we want to rename akamora (or at least leave in some sort of dragon bit)

Are we still going with Sload's "Almalexia fucked a dragon" story?

[Thrignar Fraxix]

I don't see any reason not to

[Yeti]

I like Akamora. It might be a building block name but it's one that at least sounds good. Having a few names that have lame English translations would also be keeping with the original Bethseda naming theme.


I don't really care wheither the others are changed. Bosmora is a bit of a turd though. Nith-Morhan however doesn't look right to to me.


And for the love of Vivec don't change Tear!

[RelinQ]

Im glad to see Akamora is staying.

About Tear, I agree with BC it should be left as is.

Please leave it >.<

[blackbird]

I think Tyr Dres is a good compromise and let's assume the Imperial adress this city as Tear, but the real dunmer name is Tyr Dres.
BTW if you really want to leave Tear, why shouldn't we leave the name Blacklight either?

[Scamp]

I don't have anything against Blacklight

I don't care if is it redefined though.

But I want Akamora to stay as it is.

[Adanorcil]

I don't care about Tear much either way. My solution didn't even involve an actually name change, but I'm fine keeping it the way it is.

Im glad to see Akamora is staying.

You're kind of leaping to conclusions there, but since everyone seems to be infatuated with the in my opinion tasteless Akamora, I'll concede.

But Bosmora goes. I don't care what it becomes, as long as it's not that. Make suggestions.

Having a few names that have lame English translations would also be keeping with the original Bethseda naming theme.

Out of curiosity, explain to me how this is in keeping with the Bethesda naming theme.

BTW if you really want to leave Tear, why shouldn't we leave the name Blacklight either?

Because that's an even more terrible one.

[immortal_pigs]

some suggestions
Baloreth
Valoreth
Salothril
Salaren
Teyn
Thalms
Indarys

[Aeven]

To be honest I like all of those, and I see them as usable for lots of exteriors. The only one I doubt is Indarys, as I believe that's a Redoran surname.

[SamirA]

Teyn sounds like a sweet Imperial city name (at least the way I pronounce it {Tay - in} or even {Tain}).

[Why]

Adan's original suggestion for Bosmora wasn't too shabby imo. On the other hand, do we have any lore about the founding of the village yet?

[Katze]

I second Why in not having a problem with Adanorcil's Bosmora replacement suggestion.

Can I steal Teyn for my imperial town? I'm becoming kinda attached to it. The fort still needs a name, though.

[SamirA]

I would like to ask why Blacklight is being changed when it is on an official Bethesda Map? I thought TR didn't want to change original Bethesda Material. Now I know this applies mainly to in game material but I would argue that changing official names runs in the same vein as altering in game Vvardenfel. Blacklight, Tear, Necrom, and some others appear to be official so in my book they should remain that way to stay as close to the true vision of the province as possible. Whether you like the name or not is secondary to is it canon or not.

This may have in some way changed and my statement merely be one made out of ignorance but as I see it those are official names and should remain the names of the cities in those locations no matter how bad they suck. If Bethesda wanted to put a town called Barney the Purple Dinosaur on the map of the area TR is creating I say we just have to call the town that. But thats me, I like to stay as close to Bethesda as possible when creating their world. I mean we are creating a province of Tamriel right? Not just making some huge landmass mod of our own design?

...Climbing down off of the soap box...
Thank you all for your time, I couldn't have done this without the support of my family and friends, and all of you out there in TR...what's that? Oh it wasn't a real speach? I beg pardon...

[Katze]

Blacklight is still the name Imperials would use to refer to the city, Baan Malur is just the more commonly used Dunmeri name. The maps Bethesda publish are generally from an Imperial viewpoint, so it makes sense that they'd use the imperialised version of names for all of the locations.

[SamirA]

So if I speak to some Imperial guy around they will mention Blacklight? As long as there are references to original official names then im Kosher with it. That is a sufficient explanation so long as references are in place within proper context.

[Adanorcil]

I would like to ask why Blacklight is being changed when it is on an official Bethesda Map? I thought TR didn't want to change original Bethesda Material. Now I know this applies mainly to in game material but I would argue that changing official names runs in the same vein as altering in game Vvardenfel. Blacklight, Tear, Necrom, and some others appear to be official so in my book they should remain that way to stay as close to the true vision of the province as possible. Whether you like the name or not is secondary to is it canon or not.

This may have in some way changed and my statement merely be one made out of ignorance but as I see it those are official names and should remain the names of the cities in those locations no matter how bad they suck. If Bethesda wanted to put a town called Barney the Purple Dinosaur on the map of the area TR is creating I say we just have to call the town that. But thats me, I like to stay as close to Bethesda as possible when creating their world. I mean we are creating a province of Tamriel right? Not just making some huge landmass mod of our own design?

...Climbing down off of the soap box...
Thank you all for your time, I couldn't have done this without the support of my family and friends, and all of you out there in TR...what's that? Oh it wasn't a real speach? I beg pardon...

I would like to ask why Blacklight is being changed when it is on an official Bethesda Map? I thought TR didn't want to change original Bethesda Material.

It's not being changed; it has changed. This is because Tamriel Rebuilt is a modification.

Now I know this applies mainly to in game material but I would argue that changing official names runs in the same vein as altering in game Vvardenfel. Blacklight, Tear, Necrom, and some others appear to be official so in my book they should remain that way to stay as close to the true vision of the province as possible. Whether you like the name or not is secondary to is it canon or not.

If canon had existed, Morrowind wouldn't have and neither would TR.

This may have in some way changed and my statement merely be one made out of ignorance but as I see it those are official names and should remain the names of the cities in those locations no matter how bad they suck. If Bethesda wanted to put a town called Barney the Purple Dinosaur on the map of the area TR is creating I say we just have to call the town that. But thats me, I like to stay as close to Bethesda as possible when creating their world. I mean we are creating a province of Tamriel right? Not just making some huge landmass mod of our own design?

I am sure you say this out of respect for the game and its developers, which is commendable, but ultimately, yes: your statement is steeped in ignorance. There is no such thing as an official name. If the developers of this game hadn't realized themselves that some of the stuff they had made up earlier -if they had thought they couldn't mess with their own canon- you'd now have to go look for Caius Cosades in the city of Stoneforest. If they had made the rest of Morrowind, chances are likely Blacklight would have been renamed too. Fiction is malleable like that.

And even that doesn't take away that Blacklight is really just an awfully bad name and not just because it sounds emo. These names were all made up on the fly to cover a meaningless map for a game made in 1994. Many of these, including Blacklight, were made up by a random name generator. Whoever put the name on that ancient map gave it less thought than how many lumps of sugar they wanted in their coffee.

So ask yourself. You want to make TR as good as the rest of Morrowind. Don't you think the gods at Bethesda would have felt silly for not changing Barney the Purple Dinosaur? Wouldn't you have thought they were silly and spineless for doing anything about that? Really, no one's going to reprimand TR for not following all the material Bethesda provided to the letter. On the contrary.

So yeah, you can imagine the Imperials call it Blacklight if it really really soothes your mind. But that's not its name.

[Myzel]

We all act under the supposition that we at TR know how Bethsoft meant things to be even better than Bethsoft themselves.

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

And largely because that's true, when we're talking people like Ada and Sload.

You've seen Oblivion: Beth are hardly our 100% source of awesome.

This thread = can of worms. Every time.

[Adanorcil]

EDIT: This was actually meant to go in my other post. But then I screwed up and almost double posted. But then you guys had already posted before this one, so it's all fine and dandy.

some suggestions
Baloreth
Valoreth
Salothril
Salaren
Teyn
Thalms
Indarys

Indarys is indeed a last name. The first three and number five sound a bit like last names and make use of the TH a lot, which a number of major places (Othrensis, Andothren) already use. See below for Teyn. Since some people liked the suggestion for Woodwood and some didn't I'll try and throw out some more stuff:

Morhad
Morhad Uvan
Morhad Umayn
and variations

Can I steal Teyn for my imperial town? I'm becoming kinda attached to it. The fort still needs a name, though.

If you're really attached to it, I'm ok with it, but I do feel Teyn sounds a little unimperial with the Y. It might work better with something a little more romance-language sounding. I'm just brainstorming off of the original: Teniand, Tehanid, Ternuph, Taenid, Edance, Hedin, Teinom, Tabbaen...

As for the fort: I think we have long ran out of sensible -moth names. We can pretty much go with whatever sounds good at this point.

We all act under the supposition that we at TR know how Bethsoft meant things to be even better than Bethsoft themselves.

You've seen Oblivion: Beth are hardly our 100% source of awesome.

Those are two other ways of putting it.

[Scamp]

I think we have long ran out of sensible -moth names

Why not try some of these:

hillmoth
rivermoth
stormmoth
rainmoth
stonemoth
skymoth

only suggestions, though.

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

That's the exact opposite of what Adanorcil meant.

For the time being, this thread is spiraling out of control and getting on my nerves, and so I'm locking it. Anyone else with powers can undo this, if they see fit. But currently, we're going nowhere helpful.