earworthm's showcase

[earworthm]

Good evening to everyone,

A few minutes after registration (that is, ten days back or something like that) I went to the forum, in order to see what was required to collaborate to this project. As I understand it, some preliminary work is required in order for you to evaluate newcomers' capacities.

As I had never done anything but minor script and dialogue changes so far, and nothing big enough to be a mod in itself, I am currently trying to create a quest (it involves an old mage in his tower in Ald Velothi so far), so that I have something to show you.

So here is the esp. To begin the quest you will need to talk with Drayane Anthas in the mages guild in Ald'Rhun (she's in the unoccupied chamber on the way to the guild guide).

As you have probably noticed, English is not my mother tongue, so proofreading might also be required (by the way, in the very unlikely case where translations to French are needed, feel free to ask .

If you have any questions so far, I will do my best to provide answers as soon as possible. The two main issues I stumbled upon were :
- Making Dayvith follow the player in a sensible way
- And preventing the player from using Recall in the secret cavern (you will figure out if you try it - if you want me to describe the quest thoroughly I can do it however)

So, I think this is mainly a quest showcase. However, if you think I could help somewhere else I would be happy to oblige.

Now, that is quite a wall of text... I'm stoping now !

Ah, and sorry for the pathetic name of the quest... I suppose his parents had nothing better to do than to name him this way...

[Jonaman8]

First of all, welcome to the project!
I did a quick run through your quest and I tried to write a review.

Clean: Very, very dirty
Dependencies: I don't know if it's neccesary, but I think your file has to be dependant on Morrowind, Tribunal, Bloodmoon and TR_Data.
Story: Good.

I found a few errors.
-If you tell him to wait for you, and you continue to the cavern, he will also be there.
-You can indeed recall out of there, which will break the quest. (You can go back and activate the scroll though.)
-In the topic help me, you accidently used the Journal "DwarvenMystery" instead of "Dayvith_Quest"

Grammatical errors I found:
-She lookd astonished at what the wizard had done...
Must be looked
-As I gave her the amulet, she looked surpised however.
Must be surprised
-... just in case this kind of problem would happen, but he doesen't remember where.
Must be doesn't
-... and his children have left the island, though he doesen't even know if they are still in Morrowind. (2x)
Must be doesn't
-He himslelf feels that is life is to end soon...(2x)
Must be himself
-I have met drayane Anthas at the Guild of Mages in Ald-Rhun.
Must be with a capital
-I can't believe a dremora could came in.
You already have a past verb, so came must be come.
-And look at what it did !
Drop the space between did and the exclamation mark
-Isn't this place just amazing ?
Drop the space between amazing and ?
-Need I call the guards ?
Same as above
-(funny to say such a thing, by the way: well, yeah, just loot my corpse; oh, my !)
Again, drop the space
-"Choice ""Yes ?"" (2x)
Same as above
-But what, you say ?
Again, drop the space
-BUT WHAT ?
Same
-... as it was linked to my mind !
Same
-Yeah, another bunch of the same mistakes.
Just drop the space!
-Hum, excuse me, I can be a bit excentric sometimes.
Must be eccentric
-Well, I'm suprised he left no message for me.
Must be surprised
-It is so sad that you cound not protect him, though.
Must be could
Say that you have delivered the letter and ommit the death of Dayvith Fyr and his amulet
Must be omit
-Well, I really hope I can find some time to visit hime some day.
Must be him
-They killed my wife, and nowthey prevent me from getting to my secret cavern.
Must be now they
-These beast must be taken care of, musn't they ?
Must be beasts and mustn't
-...and we enjoed with my wife hiking around.
Must be enjoyed and this order would be better: ...and I and enjoyed hiking around with my wife.
-Note: I hope you are doing well in Ald Velothi, and that the gods are more gentle to you than they once were.
Should be gentler

Your scripts are good, but they are a bit messy.
To fix your Recall error, use DisableTeleporting and EnableTeleporting. I can't see what's wrong with the following of Dayvith.
You should also need to use the TR naming conventions, which can be found somewhere on the forum (not sure where).
You should also clean your file using TESAME, which can be downloaded from the utilties list. Cleaning means deleting dirty references, because the CS changes some things you didn't want to change.

That was quite a list, but you should be able to fix it. This is the first review I do, so you should probably wait for someone else to come by.

EDIT: Oh yeah, I forgot to say, you made nice interiors!

[Why]

Dependency on TR_Data is allowed, not required. Thanks for the review though Jonaman

[earworthm]

Thanks very much for the review. I will try to fix these issues and clean the file over the week-end.

And I have not downloaded any TR material so far, so it does not depend on TR_data. Yet be sure that any posterior work will depend on it... if you think it is worth the pain, I can also put my work on TR_data.

[The Greatness]

Don't bother downloading TR Data just to make a dependancy on it- as Why said it's not necisary. Do download it so you can play TR .

[earworthm]

By the way, which TR_data am I supposed to keep in the Data Files folder (maps 1 and 2 both have one) ?
And why can't my game seem to load lots of textures (I get plenty of error message and yellow ! when I get to firewatch) ?

And right, no dependancy on TR. I will correct it, though.

[The Greatness]

You don't need to download map 1: map 2 has an updated version of map 1 and the version of TR_Data you need to use. Also, if you're getting those errors it means you haven't registered your BSA. Map 2 has a program that does it for you I believe.

Anyway, looking forward to your next version.

[earworthm]

I had just another question, about the naming conventions (by the way I could only find the TESIV ones) : what is this "map number" they are talking about?
And won't naming a cell this way make odd things happen ingame (e.g. "Wooden Door to Tr04i001TheOldTower")?

[Katze]

The Map number is just the number of the development map the interior or exterior is located on, and there are 6 of these maps. If you want to stick to conventions with your showcase, it's probably easiest to say your interior is on map 0.

Cells are named after their claim numbers only up until the merging stage, as it makes finding locations and cleaning much easier in large claims such as NPC Detailing. They get given their proper names when a merged file is being prepared for release.

[earworthm]

Here is the mod with the corrections. I have also tried to clean it, but I am not used to using Tesame, so please tell me if there is something wrong.

The longuest part was to find the references of custom items in scripts and dialogues and to rename them to suit the conventions.

Oh, and I will try to drop the space !

(worry not, for this one is on purpose)

And I also had a hard time getting a suitable connection. But here is the esp.

[MSam]

Hey,

I can't download your file - although it says I've done it twice. Would you mind re-uploading?

[earworthm]

Aaah, crappy connection...

I hope it is better?

Edit : apparently it works for me now.

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

Hey earworthm, I'm afraid I don't right now have any time to personally look over your showcase file.

However, based on Jonaman's comments and the content of your forum posts I would suggest that writing quests will be problematic for you. They rely entirely on dialogue, and at present it seems your writing has a high quantity of errors and typos (I would guess you're not a native speaker). All of these errors or typos would have to be individually fixed by someone else if they made it into the actual mod, which takes a very long time and inevitably lowers the overall quality of our dialogue.

If the next review of your file still shows a high quantity of errors, I would advise that you apply for another area of work at TR. Our quest department is very shorthanded, so having to spend time re-tweaking supposedly completed quests would effectively double our workload.

Apologies for the bluntness, but this is an unfortunate truth. I personally have had to invest many hours of my modding time in the past to fixing up the errors introduced by poor-English speaking dialogue writers.

[The Greatness]

Actually I just had a quick look at this in TESAME and the dialogue looks fine. Maybe one or two small mistakes, but no-more than anyone else would make considering the shear amount of dialogue here! I also had a quick look at the scripts and they look fine, I just hope they don't run constantly at any point. I'll try and have a play of this if I get the chance, but I like the look of what I see. I see also you've had a go at naming conventions, but they aren't quite correct. I'm not sure if non-modders actually have access to the naming conventions though. In addition your esp isn't clean yet. You need to get rid of anything you haven't directly edited. Any statics or items you haven't changed need to be cleaned. It doesn't matter if you placed it in a cell or anything, that is stored in that cells record, so you'll need to try and clean this properly. Wait for someone to review it fully before you make any changes though, and maybe if the quest is fine all that'll need doing is a bit of cleaning and renaming.

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

This may be a result of Jonaman and others' corrections. Earworthm, it might be worth providing a second, new file, focusing on dialogue, and doing your best to avoid any errors in grammar or spelling. We should be able to tell from that whether your English will be a problem or not.

[The Greatness]

Oh, right. I thought he said he'd expanded the quest for some reason. I must have been thinking of someone else.

[earworthm]

I understand your point. Actually most mistakes were apparently inattention ones (plus the no-space-before !? thing). Anyway, if there are still to many of them I am ready to do something else (interiors?).

And no, I did not expand the quest...

What kind of new file could I provide, which would focus on text? Perhaps a book, or another quest based purely on dialogue?

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

Just a quest based purely on dialogue, with enough to be a sufficiently developed quest.

Just take your time and proofread, try and catch as many errors as you can. If you're able to correct yourself without regular errors left over, then you could carry on showcasing for quests.

You're more than welcome to look at any other area of TR, however, where language is not an issue. Only questing requires the ability to write dialogue. If you definitely want to use scripting, more advanced interiors can make use of quite complex scripts (although overdoing that would be a bad thing).

[earworthm]

So, here it is. The quest is set in Massahanud Camp, southwest of Indoranyon stronghold.

The two issues I have met so far:
- Picking up the amulet (I have no clue on how to do this once I have begun a script with onactivate)
- Changeing the ownership of the beds once the quest is finished

If my English remains to poor to be of some use, I will gladly make interiors however.

[Andres Indoril]

To pick up the amulet, just add activate into the functions in the OnActivate section, I'd guess?

Edit: Bed ownership should just mean that you add that variablething or whatever below the owner to be a global variable or something alike.

[earworthm]

Code: Select all

if ( onactivate == 1 )
	if TR00_Quarrel == 50
	journal TR00_Quarrel 55
	activate
	endif
endif

Do you mean, something like this? (the journal thing is because finding the amulet is needed to complete the quest)

I tried it, but I still fail to pick up the amulet.

[Why]

that's probably because the activate is within the getjournalindex=50 check which means this script won't do anything unless the journal index is 50. If you allow the player to pick up the item before 50 make sure you get a journal update when you have it in your inventory when you reach 50.

[earworthm]

I have found an alternative solution : using the condition 'item' within the dialogue (you can call me silly now... I had not seen it at first...).

Anyway, should I upload it with this modification ?

[earworthm]

Anyway, if no one has time to review it, perhaps I should stick to making interiors, as apparently I can make passable ones.

Any advice ?

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

So so sorry, i am being hugely busy in real life at the mo'.

It certainly wouldn't hurt to run an interiors showcase at the same time - they get reviewed a lot faster, and you're more than welcome to showcase for multiple departments!

I promise I will check out your quest when I get a chance, regardless!

[earworthm]

OK, I have done a small interior - a house belonging to a telvanni student in Sadrith Mora. No script, no dialogue, one item created (the student's draft paper on an unlikely issue; it is not completely ready yet, obviously...).

I have met one issue so far, and have no clue on how to solve it (cf. screenshot).

There is also the esp for the dialogue/quest showcase, quarrel, in an updated version (solved the amulet problem - hopefully).

And do not worry about this - real life is of course mouch more important than that.

[MSam]

Hey,

Sorry I don't have time to review your Quest showcase. I would really like to but I have no time...I need to be awake in 5 hours to leave (noooooo). You don't need to create exteriors or NPCs for your interior showcase, since separate departments handle them.

Lighting looks okay, you've got grid snap and a north marker. Excelleeent.

I won't beat around the bush since I'm tired and I'm going on holidays tomorrow, and I'm sure you just want to know what to fix.

-Furn_de_rug_big_02 at the entrance is sunk a little too much, but it's fine.
-Technically you've placed the sacks properly, but this is one object that you're permitted to sink into the floor a little. This is so they appear natural and not balancing on the tip at the bottom.
-de_drawers_02_mclothes4 is bleeding into the back wall, and floating above the floor. Move it out and f that shitttt!
-light_de_candle_18_64 on top of it needs to be rotated since it's floating at the back.
-com_sack_01_saltrice_5 is bleeding a little into the other sack, but that's okay. But you should sink the other sack for the natural look (see above).

-Furn_de_rug_big_01 in the main room, same case as the beginning.
-I like your chair placement, but there's too much going on. bk_onoblivion is floating, hammer_repair is floating, misc_com_redware_plate is floating, and the chair itself is floating. Just move it all down a notch and it should be okay. In fact, just 'f command' it all, and it'll look fine.
-TRBookSclNotesByThurval should be a little lower, but I'd be entertained to hear how a player would be able to see it's floating.
-The book pile is a cool idea, but it's floating.
-furn_de_p_bench_03 is floating
-furn_de_p_table_04 is also floating.
-All the cutlery* is floating
-misc_de_bowl_glass_peach_01 is well placed, but you can give it the same treatment as the sacks, in that they can be bled a little for a more natural appearance.

-bk_AedraAndDaedra on the top shelf is floating
-bk_BlueBookOfRiddles** is really nicely blanced, but everything else on the second shelf needs to be adjusted.
-Everything on the third shelf needs adjustment.
-bk_redbookofriddles is floating at the bottom.

*Silverware, and any common cutlery, is considered an alien influence on Dunmer customs, and is therefore style mixing. If you aren't aware of style mixing, feel free to search or ask for clarification
**Try not to include more than one valuable book. There are a couple in this place worth >=200gp

Ho hum. All in all not a bad job. Some basic mistakes that everyone makes when they first embark on the epic quest to attain entry to interiors in TR. I can only say what I say to everyone else, and that's take a careful look at how you place all your objects. If you need some help in finding out how objects should be placed (with the dotted lines) please ask - there are expert modders here who'd be delighted to help out because it's always great to see someone blossom into awesomeness and join the project.

Keep at it! See you all in one monthhh!

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

Hi earworthm, sorry for the delay. Finally have some free time again.

I am in a slight quandry over your showcase ... on the forums your English is pretty bad (to be frank), however in your .esp the errors are only minor and it's nowhere near as poor in terms of grammar and syntax. The only problems were a very few typos and a repeated misuse of the word 'apology'.

Is it the case that you do more proofreading and check-ups on your quest dialogue than you do when you write here on the forums? If so, if we can rely on you to keep doing that, I'd consider you as a potential quester. But your less good writing on the forum makes me nervous...

Can you help explain the discrepancy?

[earworthm]

Well, I have been much more cautious and have profread my work a few times while testing the quest. While on the forums, well, I do not care too much about this (I try to avoid mistakes, but I am aware it is far from perfect...).

But don't worry, I have truly submitted and created this quest on my own, without anyone helping me finding mistakes and correcting them.

Oh, and I have corrected the interior. I will upload it as soon as possible.

Edit: by the way, what would be best instead of 'apology'?

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

Okay, I think you're probably alright to carry on showcasing for quests, then.

Could you create a new quest (sorry to do this again, but the more dialogue I see you write, the less I need to worry) which includes some more complex scripting and things - please make sure your dialogue is as error free as possible, but don't worry about including too much - focus on showing off your scripting abilities. What the quest is is up to you.


Re: apology, you were using it as a verb, when it is a noun. Instead it should have been 'apologize'.

[earworthm]

Allright, then. Do you think I can use the idea I posted here?
[url]http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=23000[/url]

[The Greatness]

I doubt that would be a problem, as long as you set it on Vvardenfell. You might want to consider an alternative to crab meat as that part of the quest is rather poor plotwise. To save yourself time stick to vanilla ints too, although you can make ints if you want. Make sure you can fit some good scripts in that story too.

[earworthm]

OK, I will do this.

Instead of crab meat, could this be, say, a filled soul gem or something ?

And here is the updated interior showcase, by the way.

[The Greatness]

Something like that would be good, yes. I just thought the crab meat bit seemed a bit silly and not really the sort of thing you'd want left rotting on your grave .

Anyway, good luck.

[earworthm]

Something weird is happening when I open the construction set: in addition to the usual warning messages, I get the following:

Dialogue "" type "Journal" tried to become type "topic"

Is it normal?

Once I click yes, I get the usual different topic messages, but this one worries me. Is it a serious problem?

[Bloodthirsty Crustacean]

If you go through all the journal entries you have created, just 'select' them one by one by clicking on them, re-save and it should go away.

This is a common error and not a problem (except in that error messages are annoying), I forget exactly what causes it.

[earworthm]

Fine, the showcse is on its way. I will have very little internet access during the next two weeks, but it should be ready by 2011.

[SamirA]

Ok here is a review for your interior showcase.

First off no exterior or NPC should be created for an interior showcase. Your file is dirty, though it may be due to the presence of the NPC and possibly an exterior which I did not check for.

You set a northmarker which is good and you checked the illegal to sleep here box, also good.

Your light setting are a bit bright, in game they will appear even brighter.

What you need to do is create a new interior with a modular tileset (preferably Hlaalu) and make sure that it will fit into one of the existing exterior shells. The cell needs to be two stories so we can get enough content to review and use de_p furniture so that we can gauge your ability to rotate items. Your current interior has many bleeders and floaters. Make sure that you are careful when you place items and make sure that they are resting properly on their surfaces. I have faith that you can accomplish these goals and pass this showcase. Good luck!

[earworthm]

Thanks for the review. I will try to do a Hlaalu interior. Two stories, not too much valuable items, as few bleeders and floaters as possible. And no NPC.

And here is the quest review. I decided to scrap the visit to the dead father, because in hindsight in looked silly to me.
The stage is set in Suran, you will need to talk to Hinur Mashabas, a dark elf wearing an extravagant shirt.

I could not test the possibility of being a high rank Hlaalu, because I currently lack such a character, but otherwise everything should work.

Oh, and happy New Year to all! May this year not be the penultimate one.

[earworthm]

As it is more than 3 days, I post instead of editing.

I had one question about interiors: how big should they be compared to the exterior shell? I based my interior on Tyravel manor in Balmora, but it seems really big to me.

And those poor furniture really hate me! It is like 15 minutes to place a book properly (and still, it is an approximative degree of properly) on a de_p table. The ground floor is ready, though.