Almalexia Lore and NPC Planning

Not · Post by **Not** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:31 pm

So I decided to create this topic to try and put together some ideas for the future of Almalexia. After browsing through various threads and reading through a number of discussions that relate to the city of Almalexia, I noticed that for the most part, we don't actually have a single thread devoted to creating lore for this city. From what I've seen, there are a lot of different threads within numerous parts of the forums that always start with something along the lines of "Here we will be discussing the lore of Almalexia, it is the most important city in all of Morrowind" bla bla bla, and yet all those threads inevitably start talking about what to do with the architecture and it ends up becoming a debate to decide whether or not to touch it up or to just scrap it completely and redo the whole thing. Seeing as how we have the architecture down and we no longer have to worry about it, I figured it'd be nice to have a place where we can actually throw our ideas together and not worry about what goes where and whatnot (as far as building placement and exterior work goes.)

Which brings me to how we're going to tackle and give life to this amazing and spectacular one-of-a-kind city. I've been going through random parts of it, and wandering around aimlessly trying to decide where best to start. I thought it would be nice to divide it up within seperate districts, to make NPCing easier, and also to give it a ton of variety, without it having a sort of "stale" feeling.

Now with all of that being said, I was wondering what exactly we have so far. Obviously it's going to be the seat of House Indoril, and I believe that they have (9...?) councilors I think was decided, I'm not sure. Either way, I was wondering what sort of quests could take place there, how exactly the rest of the faction quests would fit in here, and so on.

I have a few ideas, but I'll post them when I have a bit more time. As for now, I really just wanted to get this topic rolling.

Post by **Haplo** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:00 pm

Much of the Indoril discussion already exists in the House Indoril thread, though I know this is supposed to focus on Almalexia.

As for the councilors, they are listed here in rough format:
http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=277267#277267

Nemon · Post by **Nemon** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 9:25 pm

My reasoning for elevating Mournhold:

- Greatness. In a game of this kind, having a towering epic city is just plain and simple cool. It doesn't necessarily build heavily upon lore (although I'll get to that later), but it simply looks nice. Almalexia will be visible from quite some distance, as well.

- Mehrunes Dagon trashed Old Mournhold, and lore states a new city was built upon the ruins. It doesn't say Her Grace threw a shitload of rocks on top of the ruins but it does satisfy some lore parts having it elevated as such. We're also leaving small parts of OM architecture here and there, adding to the history of the place.

Not · Post by **Not** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:54 pm

Nemon wrote:My reasoning for elevating Mournhold:

- Greatness. In a game of this kind, having a towering epic city is just plain and simple cool. It doesn't necessarily build heavily upon lore (although I'll get to that later), but it simply looks nice. Almalexia will be visible from quite some distance, as well.

- Mehrunes Dagon trashed Old Mournhold, and lore states a new city was built upon the ruins. It doesn't say Her Grace threw a shitload of rocks on top of the ruins but it does satisfy some lore parts having it elevated as such. We're also leaving small parts of OM architecture here and there, adding to the history of the place.

I think you misunderstood me, and I really wasn't very clear so let me clarify. I created this thread so that we could get a list of ideas concerning lore for NPCs and quests, to literally "give life to the city."

What I meant as far as people constantly debating the architecture and arguing about building placement and what goes where; was that the only threads (that I've seen) as far as Almalexia lore creation goes, were that of someone (usually Adanorcil) wanting to start a topic to get ideas for lore, and then all of a sudden people would ignore the purpose of the specific thread and start arguing about whether or not Almalexia should be touched up or scrapped and redone entirely. Because of this, I've noticed that all our ideas concerning the lore around Almalexia are now currently all over different threads, and the purpose of this one was to get all those ideas into this one thread, as well as add new ones if and when needed. This is a huge city, and I wanted to kind of get familiar with what we've already decided and make sure we put down all our ideas here as far as lore and NPCing goes, so that quest creation and dialogue writing could be that much easier.

What I was getting at, was that those topics are over a year old now, some of them almost two years, and I believe we have Almalexia looking exactly the way we want it now, being the "jewel of Morrowind" if you will. Now that we've got Almalexia looking absolutely incredible and awesome, I feel as though we can finally start a thread where we can skip all the arguing and debating over how it looks and whether or not it needs to be touched up, and actually get on with posting some ideas for NPCs, and how to go about bringing it to life, and actually talk about possible quests and lore and dialogue etc. Ultimately what I'm trying to say is; Almalexia looks fucking awesome the way I see it, and I don't see why we'd need to debate over how it looks anymore when two years later it's damn near perfect now.

Which brings me to Nemon's last post: Nemon, I was blown away with my jaw dropped when I came upon the city of Almalexia for the first time, and by no means would I ever question your decisions as far as exteriors go. In my opinion, your decision to elevate Mournhold was just pure brilliance on your part, and I think it's absolutely breathtaking. I haven't seen a city on Oblivion or even Skyrim for that matter, that I feel could compare with the glory that is Almalexia.

Edit: I just went back and reread my first post, and wow, that really came off wrong, I completely misworded the first paragraph entirely. Anyways, I hope this last post helps; I don't want to discuss anything as far as exterior/landscape editing goes, I just want to talk about actual lore, specific to the NPCs that will inhabit the city as well as possibilities for a variety of quests and dialogue scenarios. Sorry for any confusion.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:46 pm

Ok, so Almalexia is the city of the goddess of the same name, who is distinguished from the other members of the Tribunal by her relationship with her people being both more "motherly" and also more personal than that of the other members of the Tribunal with the dunmer. Accordingly, I think that expressions of religiosity in the city should emphasize the communal and public nature of religion for the Indoril.

Accordingly, here are some ideas:
-The Basilica of Her Grace was conceived of as a public place of worship for her people: where all of the Lady's people could come for public worship.

-The city should have a gondolier system, which is also useful for gameplay reasons, of course. It could be cool if this system was a religiously-run one. A certain order of monks could run it as a service to Her people, receiving alms in return.

-The Indoril society is highly unequal, but Roman-style doling out of bread by the rich nobles and the government itself, coupled with the Temple reinforcing the status quo, fairly effectively keep unrest in check. A few guys with carts can be present giving out these alms for the poor, on behalf of one noble or another. Competition could well be present, with nobles trying to show off with their generosity.

-A good number of small shrines and temples would be nice. Again, it could be nice to show some nobles very publically giving donations to these.

-Lots of emphasis should be placed on the importance of law, order, solidarity and conformity. This the big divide between the Indoril and the Redoran. They follow Ayem in the way the Redoran follow Vehk.

-While underworld elements should be present, they shouldn't be overboard in scale.

-Poverty should be present, thus necessitating the alms. Note that the Indoril prefer to leave the poor without the means to become rich, so that they can congratulate themsleves on giving them enough food for them to survive another day.

-The Indoril blame the fact that Almy hasn't walked amongst them on a vague lack of piety. Hand-wringing ensues.

Nemon · Post by **Nemon** » Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:16 am

Yup, a gondolier system is in place, with water canals all over the place.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:18 pm

More thoughts after I run around the latest WIP.

-Lots of travelers, lots of foreigners in areas that cater to travelers, larger than average foreigner population because of this, though they should tend to be in the lower class areas and not far from the foreign quarter. (which itself should probably be near the Gates of Symmachus(sp?)

-Because of the feudal land system of the Indoril, councilors aren't as tied to their manors as they would be in other houses. I would imagine many councilors have secondary manors in Almalexia proper that they stay in when in town on business. I also imagine these would be near the council house.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:57 pm

I created one of the newer areas (well, based off what Nemon started) in the _Kowloon cell. The idea is this is a somewhat 'poor' area. It's a somewhat mass housing area at the moment, or that's how I envisioned it.

I imagine it to be either Temple or Indoril owned, as a way to accommodate the traditional Dunmer inhabitants. Think of it as a kind of Aventine or something of the like. These families will have been living in Almalexia for many generations.

Nemon · Post by **Nemon** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:42 pm

Aeven wrote:I created one of the newer areas (well, based off what Nemon started) in the _Kowloon cell. The idea is this is a somewhat 'poor' area. It's a somewhat mass housing area at the moment, or that's how I envisioned it.

I envisioned it more like a indoril quarter thing, and not necessarily a poor area - which I wouldn't put up in an elevated area but more down by the canals and such. After having a walkabout the other day I personally see it more like a general housing/trade area. Understand me correctly - I'm not a big fan of poverty depicted way too obviously. I'll continue on this side of Almalexia now btw.

Post by **Haplo** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:06 pm

I'm pretty sure we agreed a few times as a team that there should be no poor areas of Almalexia. The charity of the Indoril sees to that.

Also, TF, it's Symmachus (two M's). Fixed that.

Why · Post by **Why** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:33 pm

Seriously though I think architecture-wise we need a lot more organisation. Currently the northern parts of the city look super formal and grand and the southern and western part look way more organic. We either need to have a grand element like those walkways in the south near Mournhold's entrance (one of the cities most holy places, I figure) or alter the northern walkways to be more organic, too.

As for the people of city Almalexia, I'd like a small majority to be commoners tied to house Indoril. That means, they don't have to be formal members of the House, because most Dunmer are members of no House, but they live in the shadow and under the protection of Great House Indoril and its nobles. I'd like to also see a rather large and more diverse group of outlanders who have been drawn to the city. Lud outlines a good amount of things in his post, too.

Nemon · Post by **Nemon** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:49 am

I'm not even done with the southern part. And I disagree, we do not need to do anything to satisfy non existing needs for symmetry or whatnot. Already by having to render the temple inside MH we have an asymmetric thing to consider, since no structure towers as such in the south part. I specifically did not want to repeat the north walkways in the south because they were both repetitive and somewhat moddy - not saying I can't make them good eventually (still not done up north either) but I wanted a different approach in the south.

I will, however, do some changes to the south ramp, to make it more accessible by foot. At first I wanted to have it closed off to regular first timers, since it's a holy city and blah blah get a passport first or something. The south east part will also remain pretty much devoid of indoril architecture, since I want the river banks here. Which means another asymmetric thing, since we have buildings in the other corners of Almalexia. But this is really no great issue in my opinion. I don't want to copy the boring circle crappy Imperial City.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:29 am

How about we leave the architecture to Nemon's capable hands, and focus on the NPC discussion that this thread was created to handle. Minor changes can of course be made because of this thread to match the feel created by the NPC ideas, but I'd really like us to leave the bigger picture to Nemon, or the detailing claim thread.

Why · Post by **Why** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:25 am

I wasn't arguing symmetry, I was arguing style. But alright.

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:33 pm

Why wrote:That means, they don't have to be formal members of the House, because most Dunmer are members of no House, but they live in the shadow and under the protection of Great House Indoril and its nobles.

They're all members of a family, which owes fealty to another family, which owes fealty to a minor house, which belongs to a Great House.

Adanorcil · Post by **Adanorcil** » Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:46 pm

Barring a few imaginable exceptions that we're not interested in, Lady N is right. One way or another, everyone has some historical tie to one of the other faction.

Why · Post by **Why** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:51 pm

Obviously, but I'm a guy who thinks mainly in terms of game mechanics.

Lud · Post by **Lud** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:23 pm

Why wrote:Obviously, but I'm a guy who thinks mainly in terms of game mechanics.

This is not a bad thing. It's one thing to have a badass idea, it's another to make it implementable.

Ok, so correct me if i'm wrong, but the Indoril seem to be quite taken up with social station and class, so here are some practical ideas to implement this.

-Give each native NPC a variable (using variant TR_NPC scripts), ranging from 1-4 or somesuch, where:
1: commoners, servants, paupers, poor, etc
2: merchants, traders, shopkeepers, craftsmer
3: functionaries, guards, bureaucrats
4: nobles, high-up temple, etc

Then these can be used as the primary filtering mechanism for dialogue for Almalexia. This could very easily indicate not only a stratified society, but one where people's functions are quite set and they cannot move from job to job. The Indoril social contract is such that they make sure that you don't starve, but you don't get to rise above your station, either.

-Make extra use of the player's clothing/armour value variables, for responses whereby the NPCs will care what social class you seem to belong to.

-Religious devotion as a particularly public show of piousness, with an emphasis on doing lots of bell-ringing and chanting. Rich nobles would show their devotion by paying for the keep of orders of monks to do public prayers in their name.

-Bells being rung in the city. We have the sounds and all, it just takes a very simple script or two.

-You could even script one hour out of the day as the Indoril prayer hour, making some NPCs give different responses for that hour either ignoring you because they're muttering prayers, or asking you to join them in prayer, etc. Bell-ringing would happen periodically at the start of this hour.

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:36 pm

Depending on the actual sound, such periodic bell-ringing could be immersive or annoying. If it could sound like part of an ambience of other sounds then it's immersive. If Almalexia has no other ambient noise and the sound seems like those bells are rung right next to your head instead of in the distance, it breaks immersion.

Also: quoted from Gro-Dhal.

"So it's the Brindisi Gate you're looking for, Serjo? Well that's halfway across the city so I hope you're not in a hurry. Look, you can duck down that alley if you're not afraid of being caught in a tight spot, or you can cross the steam gardens for a more scenic journey. Then when you're on Serynis Way, go left. You'll pass the Indoril Academy on the left, and the other government buildings. If you run into one of those yellow-robed mandarins, be sure to apologise. Those slave bracers are just ornamental and they can make your life as hard as they please if you cross one of them. Turn right at the fountain, then second left. It's another alley with a drinking den- if you get a moment stop in, it's run by one of the friendlier of the lesser Tongs. At the other end of the alley is the glass market- they sell all sorts of high end imported stuff there. Even horse meat sometimes.

Far end of the market, by the dragonfly shrine- that's not it's proper name, we all just call it that- there's the canal bridge. It's a good place to see the Sothists go by on their temple barge, but as you're in a rush you won't be stopping even for that minor miracle of ingenuity, I imagine. Once you're over the bridge, duck down the alley with the Green Kagouti sign (but don't go in to the gambling den. That's a less friendly Tong). When you emerge at the other end you'll see the Speaking Square with its podium. There might be a crowd if there are any good speeches being made- Llethan used to talk to the people sometimes up there. The gate is on the far side. I wouldn't cross into Mournhold though- it's a bit stale over that side, know what I mean Serjo?"