The North Andothren-Thirr merge

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 1:13 am

Claiming

Going to correct weird glitchery, and make the Dwemer lighthouse, among other things.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:44 pm

Releasing file

Andothren changes by Aeven (0.040)

- Created Dwemer lighthouse near Andothren
- merged and linked i4-464-Hla
- merged and linked i4-462-Hla
- merged and linked i4-460-Hla
- merged and linked i4-461-Hla
- merged and linked new i4-114-Hla (Council Hall) and added decoration outside to mark it as the hall
- merged and linked new i4-124-Hla (removed old versions)
- fixed giant Almalexia banner to not float
- lowered the platform beneath the banner to not float
- added some braziers to the platform
- general repair and improvement of NW entrance
- added doors to the Docks building, and an overhang
- makeshifted a solution to floaty caspery docks

[url=http://imgur.com/0Pqyaf6][img]http://i.imgur.com/0Pqyaf6m.jpg[/img][/url]

The only interior (I believe I forgot to merge a different one in addition to this) that needs creating, is the harbour office.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:06 pm

New file

List below with changes also include stuff that needs to be done.

Changes and observances by Aeven (0.041)

i4-76-Hla - too small and doesn't correspond to exterior shell (needs linking later too)
i4-88-Hla - Has exterior chimney, no interior fireplace
i4-86-Hla - Has exterior chimney, no interior fireplace
i4-81-Hla - Has exterior chimney, no interior fireplace
i4-80-Hla - Serious issues on the exterior due to inexplicable moving of buildings without any regard
Mysterious structue behind The Dancing Cup (i4-124-Hla)
Building between i4-113 and i4-117 (i4-465-Hla) needs merging
Added back exterior door to i4-126-Hla (seriously, wtf?)
i4-108 Watchtower needs merging (NW watchtower)

Added balcony where door led to the air
Replaced WG trees with either AI or GL, to match wider region
Fixed general glitches such as bleeding and floating
HUGE caspering area under a staircase

Post by **Gnomey** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 6:51 pm

I'm going through Andothren now. I'm pretty certain at this point that only two interiors are remaining which require merging into the AT file: [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=317435]i4_465-Hla[/url] and [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=167086]i4-66-Hla[/url].

So far I've only checked the Andothren interiors in-game, and only those interiors with working load doors. I should have my complete notes up tomorrow.

Post by **Haplo** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:04 pm

I've merged in i4-66 and i4-465. I linked i4-465 but couldn't find an appropriate location for i4-66. I think I've found the right place where it is supposed to be, but it doesn't match the interior. [url=http://i.imgur.com/ATQ4wgz.jpg]Screenshot here[/url]. I've linked the front entrance to where I think it's supposed to be, but left the top door unlinked in case we ever do something about it.

I've also cleaned out a loooot of dirty cells (Suran, etc.)

New Version: 0.042

Post by **Gnomey** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:09 pm

Thanks for doing this. Your location is indeed correct, and the interior does indeed not match the exterior.

I'll be claiming this file to do random fixes to the exterior and interiors while compiling my list. I'll also be axing the chimneys.

EJRS · Post by **EJRS** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 12:05 am

I'm not sure whether this is because you've opted to use an older version, but the latest version of TR_i4-112 remains unmerged, something I noticed for no other reason than that I made the updated version.

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 12:12 am

Ah, that's lack of clarity on my part; I was referring to merged into the file. Several interiors are missing their doormarkers; I can handle that much, though, and should have them all properly linked tomorrow if all goes as planned.

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 6:33 pm

Ah, the doors are a mess. It seems the PCStronghold doors were used for a lot of the exterior, presumably because they have the identifier ex_h_ while the correct doors have simply hlaal_/hlaalu_, which explains why so many were missing when tested in-game. I'll be fixing the doors, doormarkers, northmarkers and some of the windows, noting those I don't fix because I figure the exterior may be moved.

I request permission to make some larger edits to the exterior, such as shifting buildings and stairways to improve pathing, covering up or otherwise removing odd caspers and seams and stuff, and fixing up the patchy landscape texturing.

Edit: reminder to clean out Abaelun Mine as one of the interiors links to it.

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 9:13 pm

A quick WIP file. I've replaced most of the bad doors and have been working my way through interiors, though I'm trying not to waste time on fine detailing for the time being.

Marandahir · Post by **Marandahir** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:27 pm

Query: what's the status of the Dwemer Lighthouse and its implications for the Seyda Neen Lighthouse (which in lore is supposed to be the main source of light and guidance on the Inner Sea)?

If the Dwemer Lighthouse outshines Seyda Neen (without modding, I know there are a ton of mods for Seyda Neen lighthouse), then we have a lore problem.

I know that Aeven is working on the Lighthouse as mentioned above, so I thought I'd ask.

Post by **Haplo** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:39 pm

What's the source for that claim? I definitely don't recall it as a major plot point, so chances are we can throw it out, because it doesn't make any sense. (A backwater installation with a rickety lighthouse being the source of light for the entire Inner Sea? Red Mountain would probably be brighter)

Post by **Gnomey** » Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:43 pm

It's not a major bit of lore, really, but it's worth checking up on:

scout wrote:The lighthouse of Seyda Neen is a beacon to mariners throughout the Inner Sea.

savant wrote:The piercing light of the Grand Pharos at the mouth of the harbor of the port village of Seyda Neen is a beacon to mariners throughout the Inner Sea. Most visitors from the Empire make landfall at the port of Seyda Neen, where they are processed by the Imperial Census and Excise Commission agents of the Coastguard station.

The above will still be true with our mod; Seyda Neen will be an important lighthouse, just not the only one.

The second line is rather odd, though; the lighthouse at Seyda Neen is not a Grand Pharos by any stretch of the imagination; if that's a great lighthouse, what's a normal lighthouse, a shack with a lantern? It's also hard to argue that Seyda Neen has a harbour, as such; it has one pier. My assumption would be that either the savants are just exercising poetic license, or Bethesda cut down on Seyda Neen so that it no longer reflects that dialogue line.

Either way, I couldn't find anything -- at least after a quick search of in-game dialogue and the Imperial Library -- to suggest that the Seyda Neen lighthouse was supposed to be preeminent or the only lighthouse in the Inner Sea.

Post by **Gnomey** » Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:11 am

This has been taking rather longer than I'd hoped, but I might still manage to finish it tomorrow. The simple fixes, that is. I've worked my way from i4-60 to i4-113, skipping interiors that I think require more work like the temple (i4-96). Most of what I have been doing is sinking carpets, updating northmarkers, fixing the doors, and fixing window placement. I'm getting a rather good impression of the interiors while doing so; perhaps half a dozen may need to be redone or receive heavy edits, mostly due to not fitting their shell. It's still hard to judge, though.

One thing I have noticed so far is that we may need more Hlaalu manors, but it is still perhaps too early to judge.

Post by **Haplo** » Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:37 am

Gnomey wrote:It's not a major bit of lore, really, but it's worth checking up on:

The second line is rather odd, though; the lighthouse at Seyda Neen is not a Grand Pharos by any stretch of the imagination; if that's a great lighthouse, what's a normal lighthouse, a shack with a lantern? It's also hard to argue that Seyda Neen has a harbour, as such; it has one pier. My assumption would be that either the savants are just exercising poetic license, or Bethesda cut down on Seyda Neen so that it no longer reflects that dialogue line.

Maybe the book was written before Seyda Neen's size/grandeur was decided by developers.

Post by **rot** » Fri Feb 27, 2015 9:07 am

Piece of text and vanilla game are in contradiction in Seyda Neen + the actual vanilla game isn't to be overhauled to any such extent by TR, especially not in Seyda Neen -> piece of text is to be ignored

- seems fairly straightforward to me!

Tes96 · Post by **Tes96** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 1:45 am

Gnomey wrote:The lighthouse at Seyda Neen is not a Grand Pharos by any stretch of the imagination; if that's a great lighthouse, what's a normal lighthouse, a shack with a lantern? It's also hard to argue that Seyda Neen has a harbour, as such; it has one pier. My assumption would be that either the savants are just exercising poetic license, or Bethesda cut down on Seyda Neen so that it no longer reflects that dialogue line.

Either way, I couldn't find anything -- at least after a quick search of in-game dialogue and the Imperial Library -- to suggest that the Seyda Neen lighthouse was supposed to be preeminent or the only lighthouse in the Inner Sea.

I'm pretty sure Bethesda was describing Seyda Neen according to lore and not how it's actually presented in-game. Much like how TESII Daggerfall announced holidays but nothing ever happened, or how Red Mountain is supposed to be the highest mountain in Tamriel and it's not very high at all. The game just reflects what they can do with their limited technology but their descriptions usually describe the world from a lore-perspective. Just wanted to throw that in.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat May 23, 2015 8:24 pm

Well, that took longer than it needed to. Dropping this file. Tyrion expressed interest in working on some of the smaller settlements in this file, namely [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=24357]Gol Mok[/url], which requires a few adjustments to conform to the new coastline, and [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=24868]Gnas Mor[/url] (working name), which still needs to be created. Hopefully I haven't kept him waiting too long.

There's still a lot to be done on Andothren, but now that I've got the interiors all linked up and sorted out I'll be focusing on the planning side of things.

Now for the list of interiors, with the changes I made to them and a few notes on what might still need to be done. I'll be padding the list out with further information by and by. I haven't bothered listing the following fixes systematically, as so many interiors required them:

-replaced incorrect door placement (pcfort doors)
-fixed the northmarker
-fixed window placement
-sunk the carpets a little

[spoiler]TR_i4-59 - unlinked. This guard tower is to become a harbour admin building. It looks to be halfway through a re-purposing anyway. I'm thinking that -- as all the guard towers are rather empty in places -- what detailing there is could probably be moved over to them to pretty them up and as a sign of slavish devotion to prior work that isn't inherently awful.
TR_i4-60 - has an egregious bleeder (planter) in a rather empty room. Windows and northmarker not aligned. Adjusted some object placement, added some detail. This will need to be moved anyway.
TR_i4-61
TR_i4-62 - rather empty. Doublecheck whether player can fit between bed and railing. Texture seam right outside.
TR_i4-63 - Has beds to rent.
TR_i4-64 - Building will still be moved.
TR_i4-65 - very basic.
TR_i4-66 - unlinked. Still unmerged. Ask Seneca about the shell -> does it work for ex_hlaalu_b_18?
TR_i4-67
TR_i4-68 - re-added missing bed.
TR_i4-69 - abandoned house; looks like there was a shakeup; Camonna Tong/Hlaalu? Placement needs fixing up.
TR_i4-70 - fixed some placement errors.
TR_i4-71
TR_i4-72 - fixed lower door. The interior may be too big and empty.
TR_i4-73 - looks to be a thief; I'd actually missed the hidden basement at first.
TR_i4-74
TR_i4-75 - guard tower. This actually used Velothi doorways and doors for the cells, which I have fixed. This interior has a jail; we may want to discuss that.
TR_i4-76 - linked. Door was linked to Abaelun Mine. Heavily altered layout of top floor as a door was missing. Bookshelves were bleeding, also fixed.
TR_i4-77 - the make-shift potters' wheel replaced with our model. Has a mediocre fireplace.
TR_i4-78 - linked. Doormarker placement fixed.
TR_i4-79
TR_i4-80 - building placement fixed.
TR_i4-81 - a little empty; fixed chairs, fixed column. Interiors still iffy, and I want to at least remove the shrine.
TR_i4-82 - guard tower; very fortified. May want to move it around a little.
TR_i4-83 - fixed northmarker, upside down doorway, door locks.
TR_i4-84 - a touch empty. Window removed.
TR_i4-85 - fixed doorway. A touch empty.
TR_i4-86 - linked. Interior too empty?
TR_i4-87 - this one actually features a fireplace. Locks adjusted.
TR_i4-88 - doesn't quite fit exterior.
TR_i4-89 - a little empty? Door aligned.
TR_i4-90
TR_i4-91 - relatively well-to-do Hlaalu Council Company agent?
TR_i4-92
TR_i4-93 - guard tower; very fortified.
TR_i4-94 - fixed bucket; transform into family condo?
TR_i4-95
TR_i4-96 - the temple should be one of the sites to see in the city, but it's largely empty, and currently has a Veloth focus when Veloth passed far to the south at Almas Thirr and this should now have an Alma focus if anything, and its tomb is hidden for some reason, and is really empty and -- in my opinion -- scrap-worthy.
TR_i4-108 - unlinked guard tower. Fixed door placement; to be used with a b_13 tower.
TR_i4-109 - some sort of thief or assassin.
TR_i4-110 - linked. Successful merchant? Rather large outfitter.
TR_i4-111 - fixed storage room.
TR_i4-112 - linked. Camonna Tong spot?
TR_i4-113
TR_i4-114 - linked. Shadows on in_Hlaalu_wall odd. The Hlaalu banners on the bottom floor bleed into the wall due to their animation. I think the interior was a little under-detailed.
TR_i4-114 DEPRECATED - not actually a bad interior. I assume this was just removed to make way for the council house. Can be used elsewhere.
TR_i4-115 - house of an outlander. Replaced railing to give player more room. This interior has some rather sloppy detailing; I fixed the most egregious errors, but it could do with some more fixing up. It doesn't fit the exterior.
TR_i4-116 - this one should be switched with another interior of the same shell.
TR_i4-117 - this tower has a lot of placement errors. A little lacklustre.
TR_i4-118 - moved chairs to provide access to bed.
TR_i4-119 - linked, moved chair. You know what? I decided to keep the Mephala banner. The proprietor is an outlander member of the Morag Tong and worships Mephala.
TR_i4-120 - moved shelf to provide access to bed.
TR_i4-121 - a little empty?
TR_i4-122
TR_i4-122, building 56, apartment 1 - deprecated; bad shell for apartment; rather empty
TR_i4-122, building 56, apartment 2 - deprecated
TR_i4-122, building 56, apartment 3 - deprecated. Imperial Talos Cult member arrested by order of Ocato. Wording on warrant not exactly stellar.
TR_i4-123
TR_i4-124 Dancing Cup - too large for its interior shell?
TR_i4-124 Trader - fixed locks. Doesn't really fit the exterior; note that the interior can extended partway into the other 124 ext. shell.
TR_i4-125 - linked.
TR_i4-126 - May be too large for its exterior shell.
TR Andothren, East Guard Tower 1 [i4-127] - style mixing.
TR Andothren, East Guard Tower 2 [i4-127] - linked door, fixed some placements errors, re-added bed. Style mixing.
TR_i4-305
TR_i4-460
TR_i4-461 - doesn't fit exterior, too fancy?
TR_i4-462
TR_i4-464
TR_i4-465[/spoiler]

Post by **Seneca37** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:08 pm

Here is the latest section file. Note that claim 4-50-hla was merged with AT North.

In addition, is a zip file of the spreadsheet to be used to clean future files. See the [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=25100]Admin Resources[/url] for the program which uses this file.

EJRS · Post by **EJRS** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:58 pm

Might I point out that 4-112 still does not use the latest approved interior?
I don't know whether this one was dropped or for some other reason.

Post by **Seneca37** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:40 pm

EJRS wrote:Might I point out that 4-112 still does not use the latest approved interior?
I don't know whether this one was dropped or for some other reason.

Thank you for pointing that out. Gnomey is currently putting everything together for the next release, I'll PM him and see about getting this change implemented.

[url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=16457]New i4-112 claim[/url]

Post by **Gnomey** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:05 pm

New file down below. I like quick changes.