Dwarven Long Bow and Arrow

Ragox · Post by **Ragox** » Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:46 pm

Well, I found an awesome Dwarven Long Bow resource by Zyndaar and Cethegus, so I went ahead and made a Dwarven Arrow for it.
I've also downscaled the original texture and redone the icon.

A .esp which adds both to the TR Testing Cell weapon crate is included.

I think this would make a good addition to our arsenal and it also took me quite some time to make, so seneca37 or whoever is responsible, please review this.

Post by **Seneca37** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:00 pm

I love the bow - the details on it (even with a scaled down texture) are wonderful.

I do not know your level of modeling expertise - but if you could do the following, it would be a great help. Also, did you scale down the texture for the arrow - I'd be interested in seeing the original texture.

Arrow Comments:
1. Did you mean to have the shaft of the arrow protrude through the tip? I do not think the shaft should stick through this type of arrow tip.

2. Could you please rotate the tail "feathers" so that 2 of them are parallel with the X-Y plane. Like below

... | <- Feather
.. O <- arrow shaft
. / \ <- Feathers
(Ignore the dots ".", just trying to get image to line up properly)

This will make it a bit easier for interior designers to place them on flat surfaces.

3. Remove duplicate vertices
4. Remove faces of "feathers" that are inside the shaft.

Long Bow Comments:
1. Remove duplicate vertices
2. At both ends, there appears to be a structure inside the long bow. Could you remove those extra faces/vertices?

The properties of these items seem good. Just listing them here so that others may comment if they see something odd.

Dwarven Arrow
Weight: 0.2
Value: 5
Health: 10
Speed: 1.0
Reach: 1.0
Enchant: 15
Chop: 1-5
Slash:0-1
Thrust:0-1

Dwarven Long Bow
Weight: 12
Value: 750
Health: 800
Speed: 1.0
Reach: 1.0
Enchant: 35
Chop: 2-35
Slash: 0-1
Thrust: 0-1

Even if you can not do the changes, I'll see that these get included in the next update of TR Data, provided no one objects.

Ragox · Post by **Ragox** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:50 pm

Thanks seneca!

The arrow is actually just a reskin I did for the Daedric Arrow mesh. The texture for it is not downscaled. I only die it to the bow because it looked out of place.

But I'm learning to work with Blender right now, so hopefully I'll soon be able to fix issues like you mentioned.

Post by **rot** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:17 pm

Interesting, I assume those would be unused antiques (even by dwemer standards)? Their having crossbows is likely significant as a characterisation point, must be careful not to dilute that.

Stats: would make better sense for it to be weaker than the crossbow, unless it's some sort of unique?
The enchant value at 35 is way excessive.

Ragox · Post by **Ragox** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:16 pm

rot wrote:Interesting, I assume those would be unused antiques (even by dwemer standards)? Their having crossbows is likely significant as a characterisation point, must be careful not to dilute that.

Stats: would make better sense for it to be weaker than the crossbow, unless it's some sort of unique?
The enchant value at 35 is way excessive.

I disagree, crossbows were never a true upgrade to the long bow, as it has little range and is comparatively slow and awkward to use. They clearly wouldn't have been unused antiques. The fact that Bethesda made none does not instantly mean that there was a important reason behind it, just like there is none for not having a Dwarven Longsword or Staff present in Vanilla Morrowind. I'd strongly assume that the lack of time on the part of the developers was the key factor here.

The enchant value at 35 is the exact same as for the Steel Long Bow, so I don't see the issue here, since all Dwarven weapons use the same enchant values as steel counterparts in Morrowind, as far as I know.

Post by **rot** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:07 pm

Oh I don't mean the martial efficiency of weapon types, which I don't know anything about, but that crossbow = mechanical ingenuity = much more of a dwemerish thing, and should be their mainstay. The fact that the only ones in vanilla were dwarven or brought by imperials doesn't seem like an oversight at all.

On the other hand there's no gameplay imperative for a uniformisation of weapons in all cultures, since bows and crossbows both use the same player skills (Marksman?). Looks like a nice model but if it was meant to become a common leveled list inclusion I don't think that's a good idea.

(never mind on the enchant value, used uesp for comparison and theirs are divided by 10, so that's indeed perfectly reasonable)

sasquatch2o · Post by **sasquatch2o** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 10:14 pm

I think dwermer weapons should appear more mechanized. A bow should be something like modern compound bows with gears and moving parts for increased draw and power.

Post by **Gnomey** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:22 pm

I haven't looked at the model yet, but from the screenshot I'd tend to agree with Sasquatch. There might be another use for the models, such as artifacts, but as far as being standard Dwemer weapons I'm not sure if they have the right look. Though again, I'm just saying this based off of the screenshots.

I do think the fact that Dwemer only have a crossbow in the base game is probably quite intentional; even the lack of longsword may be. In Morrowind, Bethesda didn't tend towards ticking all the boxes as Skyrim did. Chitin weapons are short, Orcish and Nordic weapons tended to be two-handed, etc. The imbalance was probably largely intentional.