Daedric Scimitar

Stalker · Post by **Stalker** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 10:57 pm

Yeah, yeah. Laugh at my stupidity and than watch what's going on on my streets and you'll understand it all. Revolution si coming. No jokes.

Lord_Gallant · Post by **Lord_Gallant** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:07 pm

Ah, well, then just stay inside and watch it get suppressed. It's bound to be entertaining, at the least.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:10 pm

Who has drawn the original consept for this scimitar, i would like to thank that person and say he should draw some more weapons daedric and non daedric.

Dexter · Post by **Dexter** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:20 pm

I'd say that Drizzt Do'Urden would like those two scimitars, but then I remembered that his are two pounds each and Daedric is like 40 lbs for a Katana.

I don't know about the other Elder Scrolls games, but the weight system in Morrowind is wrong. The weight of weapons cannot possibly be represented in pounds. Nobody can carry around 500 pounds worth of stuff on them. And a 90 pound battle axe? Go to your local hardware store and pick up a standard-sized sledgehammer. Try to swing that thing. That is probably around 15 pounds, now imagine swinging something that weighs six times as much. Forget it.
So, in retrospect, a Daedric katana cannot weigh 54 pounds, it has to be much less than this. I would guess that the Morrowind scale of weight is at least 10 units per pound.

Stalker · Post by **Stalker** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:28 pm

Even if it's wrong we must follow it. Plus it's told ingame that Daedric stuff is extremly heavy. Plus it's fantasy. Plus there's balance and playability.

Dexter · Post by **Dexter** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:31 pm

My point is that if it says in a previous game that something weighed 2 pounds, that does not mean that it should equal 2 units of weight in Morrowind. Someone with older games should compare the weight system with them to the current weight system, and figure out how many units of Morrowind weight equal a pound.

Eraser · Post by **Eraser** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 12:59 am

I'll check daggerfall. you are right, the system in morrowind really can't be 1 unit=1 pound, it might be in ounces, grams kg's or some other weight measurement.

Lord_Gallant · Post by **Lord_Gallant** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 2:10 am

Oh, in Daggerfall things were screwed up even more. You could carry 20 daedric warhammers along with you and be just dandy. Morrowind weight never says pounds or kilograms or anything, so it is certainly safe to say that the unit of weight is something lighter.

When trying to make a conversion factor, I think it is important to look at the Strength score. The base strength for most humans is 40 (though for Nord and Redguard males this base is 50), so it is safe to say this is "average" strength for this time. We can assume average folks to be somewhat brawnier that the average folk of our modern day, since they do a lot more daily physical labor.

You are able to carry 5 Morrowind Units (MU) of weight per point of strength you have, so we can say that your average human can carry 200 MU on his person, and this with difficulty (fatigue lowers quickly when running). Your absolute strongest humans, the real body-builders and warriors of the time, have 100 strength and are capable of carrying 500 MU with difficulty. A human can only be about 2.5 times as strong as average at his max, which doesn't seem right.

How much do you think an meatier-than-average person of our day would be able to carry around with them, in pounds? I know that I can carry a 150 lb person and keep a fair jog going, and I think that I am probably somewhat stronger than average for "western modern world" person, so I am going to take the assumtion that I probably have about a 40 Strength and can carry, with difficulty, 200 MU.

Some quick math: 200/150 = 1.333 MU per 1 lb.

Therefore, that 90 MU Daedric Battle Axe is actually 67.5 lb
That 60 MU Daedric longsword is actually 45 lb.
That 20 MU steel longsword is actually 15 lb.
That 32 MU steel warhammer is actually 24 lb.
And that 8 MU wooden staff is actually 6 lb.

Sounds about right to me with the real-world materials, except that sword seems a little heavy. What we have learned here is that daedric weaponry is extremely heavy. This also means that the "world's strongest man" can only carry 375 lb around and still maintain a steady jog.

Indoril · Post by **Indoril** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 4:32 am

My point is that if it says in a previous game that something weighed 2 pounds

It's a book actually, that that was from.

Some of the weights are screwed up, but if I remember right, a whole claymore in real life weight 25-35 lbs. The Morrowind weight for the Steel Claymore is 27.0, and it is roughly 5 ft long. It sounds about right.

Stalker · Post by **Stalker** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 10:23 am

OK. When the weight problem is figured maybe we should now decide which one should be unique one ?
[img]http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/files/thumbs/t_scimitar_render2.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/files/thumbs/t_scimitar_vor.jpg[/img]

Kasan Moor · Post by **Kasan Moor** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 4:48 pm

I really think that we should make the remaining few artifacts that were mentioned in lore but not in Morrowind (like Namira's Ring, Vaernima's Skull of Corruption, the Oghma Infinitum, and so on) and we should also create a fairly large number of artifacts that we never mentioned in the history books (like the Dagger of Symmachus, Mace of Slurring, Robe of the Lich, the Gravedigger, and so on). The new mesh Asylum made could easily become one of the lesser-known artifacts of daedric origin not found in the history books (and therefore not in the lore).

That's the main reason why I designed the List of Artifacts. Go ahead and pick your artifact. The only problem with for example Namira's Ring, the Skull of Corruption and the wabbajack, is that it is impossible to script their effects.

Dexter · Post by **Dexter** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 5:00 pm

Therefore, that 90 MU Daedric Battle Axe is actually 67.5 lb
That 60 MU Daedric longsword is actually 45 lb.
That 20 MU steel longsword is actually 15 lb.
That 32 MU steel warhammer is actually 24 lb.
And that 8 MU wooden staff is actually 6 lb.

That still seems extremely heavy to me. Go to some online sword stores and check out their ranges. Most of the swords I have been finding weigh no more than 5 pounds. And ~68 pounds Daedric battle axe is still extremely heavy, 68 pounds is essentially the weight of a fat 7 year old.
But I realized that it doesn't really matter. Since Morrowind's weight system is obviously way off, trying to get it to work in real life terms will be almost impossible. As L_G said, the beefiest men in Morrowind are only 2.5x stronger than the normal people. I'm far past 2.5x the average person's strength, and I could ge a lot stronger if I so wished. So, I say we just stick to the original weapon weights, and determine new weights by going by Bethesda weights.
Sorry to have made such a big deal about nothing. To make you feel better, now when someone on the ESF says "my 90 pound Daedric battle axe" you can say "it's not pounds, dumbass".
As for which scimitar we should use as the standard, I vote Vorrheis'. Simple because it is a more standard design, and Asylum's is much more unique looking.

Eraser · Post by **Eraser** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 5:15 pm

yes vorrheis' scimitar looks a little more standard.

really fat 7 year old? I barely weighed that much when i was 10!

fanfas · Post by **fanfas** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 5:18 pm

Stalker wrote:OK. When the weight problem is figured maybe we should now decide which one should be unique one ?
[img]http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/files/thumbs/t_scimitar_render2.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/files/thumbs/t_scimitar_vor.jpg[/img]

The dagger or small sword as you want it to be called

with some sort of enchantment.

battle_bison · Post by **battle_bison** » Sat Nov 27, 2004 5:21 pm

I believe the smaller of the two should be the unique one, I just couldn't imagine seeing more than one dremora in the game attacking with that thing, it's just way too cool looking. Not to say the other one isn't, but it seems like more of a generic one than the other.

Gooblecakes · Post by **Gooblecakes** » Sat Nov 27, 2004 5:27 pm

Dragon wrote:Very nice however you mayb want to enlarge the lenght of the blade, it looks a wee bit like a dagger currently

no, scimitars are treditionally short. scimitars are persian (i think) by origin, and have a wide blade, lonngish handle and are relativeley short. dont change the size a bit, i like it.

Devon8999 · Post by **Devon8999** » Sun Nov 28, 2004 9:31 pm

Gooblecakes wrote:

no, scimitars are treditionally short. scimitars are persian (i think) by origin, and have a wide blade, lonngish handle and are relativeley short. dont change the size a bit, i like it.

but, a scimitar is a long curved single edged sword of oriental origin. they can be found in the persian gulf area where it is spelled shamishir and the length and width may be different though.
8)