Morrowind Creatures

RelinQ · Post by **RelinQ** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:33 am

Bonelord has to many arms, and Liche is an overdone idea.

But I like the idea of robes, probably tattered and all, but the model would need to be unique though.

Also Blackbird, I think Sload mentioned (anyone correct me if Im wrong) that according to lore, Nerevar was turned into a bonewalker.

blackbird · Post by **blackbird** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:10 pm

I meant a bonewalker with a robe or maybe some other clothes and not a bonelord or a lich.

Worsas · Post by **Worsas** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:26 pm

I think it could be interesting to have a bonewalker whose head is less mutilated, more like the heads in the concept drawings here.

But who is otherwise pretty much like other bonewalkers.

btw. Are there other modders here besides me and Dirnae who would be capable of this? I thought Nalin were a 3D-modeller too.

Gil Estel · Post by **Gil Estel** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:43 pm

Is it possible to make (withe scrips or something) the Nerevar bonewalker head look like a Dunmer
version of the Nerevarine? Sorry for this stupid idea.

Katze · Post by **Katze** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:49 pm

There is no defined appearance to the Nerevarine, he (or she) is whatever the player wants to look like.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:03 pm

Lighter Than Some wrote:[url=http://img709.imageshack.us/i/longleggedvelknectardri.png/][img]http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7369/longleggedvelknectardri.th.png[/img][/url]

I believe this creature, regardless of whether it'll be THE velk or not, would look quite good in the Lan Orethan.

Also, concerning the velk: I like both Myzel and Lighter's concepts as creatures. They both deserve to end up in the mod. I believe Lighter's should be called the velk, and Myzel's, if made furrier, could be some sort of herd creature, similar to as Cathartis said on IRC, a Yak.

Why · Post by **Why** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:15 pm

Regarding Nerevar, I'm not a lore expert but I don't see why we can't have a unique model for his "bonewalker". As far as I know the term "bonewalker" isn't strictly defined as the zombie-esque tomb guardians. It could easily be a term that can be used to refer to any Temple-animated ancestor remains, also given to the creature bonewalker just because "zombie" doesn't really sound sacred, which they are. I think the latter would make sense and allow a lot more creativity.

I'm really worried Nerevar's tomb might turn out very underwhelming if we simply retexture a bonewalker creature's face. Surely the Temple would've given one of their greatest heroes and saints a bit more care than Average Joe's grumpy grandmother. I'm a big proponent of doing at least something special to Nerevar, even making him an ordinary skeleton with two Indoril guard gauntlets and one pauldron would I think look better. Though I'd prefer a unique model.

Feel free to shoot me down though.

Night0205 · Post by **Night0205** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:07 pm

I tend to agree with Why. For good reason, TR has shielded itself from things that are uber or special, because then everything would be like flying dwarves, but it makes sense to put a little bit of uberness or specialty into certain things. And I think TR has, but I also think Nerevar and Main Quests deserve a little extra creativity and "uberness", as long as it fits well in game and in lore. Nerevar is special enough to give him his own model. Also, with you guys redoing the map 1 main quest, you are thinking about cutting out the "uber" ending, which may make sense. From my understanding you are turned into a big dremora, and are used to attack the fort. But no matter how uber you are, it's only temporary, right? And there should be something that makes the main quests stick out from just a group of normal quests. Maybe I'm out of line, but I don't see why having an epic ending to a main quest is a bad thing.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:19 pm

Turning into a giant dremora and destroying firewatch goes a bit beyond epic. It is retardedly uber. We don't have map based main quests anymore anyway. Hell, we don't really even have maps anymore. This has nothing to do with the thread at hand anyway.

A ceremonially dressed bonewalker is what I would prefer, but just having him as a bonewalker works for me too. Thats because bonewalkers are not zombies, they are blessed dead meant to serve and protect. We see them and think they are gross and deformed, that isn't how they are viewed by the dunmer.

@why: bonewalkers are bonewalkers. Everything else apart from lichs are raised by the temple as well I seem to recall and named by them as well. Nerevar was made a bonewalker, this is verified.

Yeti · Post by **Yeti** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 2:42 am

My opinion is that Nerevar should have a unique model. A Bonewalker, with all the feel of one, but dressed ceremonally, and created with the outmost quality Temple "necromancy" has to offer. Just doing a retexture of a normal bonewalker wouldn't feel right, and certainly would look underwhelming to the player.

Nerevar is one of the most important characters in the game. He's a chance to do a speicel, unique creature, like Vivec, Yagrum, and Dagoth Ur were in the vanilla game.

I think Nalin's concept looks like a promising place to jump off of. Nicely drawn Nalin 8)

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:26 am

Yeti wrote:My opinion is that Nerevar should have a unique model. A Bonewalker, with all the feel of one, but dressed ceremonally...I think Nalin's concept looks like a promising place to jump off of.

I agree but then I am biased towards my concept as it is how I see Nerevar. My intentions with that concept were to portray him as closely as the temple artwork depicts him without adding the obvious "temple style embellishments" (Halo around the head and wrists and such). At the same time I am aware that the St.Nerevar concept I've drawn doesn't really much resemble a bonewalker compared to the bonewalkers we see in game.

Call it special treatment. Honoured by almsivi and dressed in his armour - He was, after all, the warrior of the chimer. Or even take it the other way and say the the binding around his mouth was placed there by the tribunal to keep him from telling others of their treachery. Or both.

Or call it artistic licence, either way I already started meshing it based off that concept (if only for my own use).

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:13 pm

you know your fucking head is fine right Nalin? like ok maybe not the hair, but the wrapped jaw and everything. its fucking great. now can someone please just fucking perfect that and make a model of a bonewalker head with a normal face and bandages around its jaw and this obnoxious masturbating session can come to an end

jesus joseph and mary we've had this conversation 9 times. it was productive once. im tired of hearing everyone go around in a circle repeating themselves to death.

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 8:10 pm

Now that Sload got that off his chest (with no more than 4 swears even), I would like to make clear that concepts on the subject are naturally still welcome.

But really, try to limit discussion in the concept art forum to the artwork. Suggestions for particular artworks are welcome. Posts by every average joe on the board throwing in their two cents on how they imagined things, are not welcome. I think we're going to run into this problem more often, now that we focus on morrowind.
Discussions about whether or not (or how) something should be modeled are totally misplaced here. Especially if the discussion has already been held elsewhere.

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:38 pm

Myzel wrote:Now that Sload got that off his chest (with no more than 4 swears even)

I counted 3

More creature concepts on the way soon.

Are we looking to re-do the riverstrider aswell? I have this idea that a giant tick-like creature would be nice to see in game and the size I have in mind for it is around the same size as the riverstrider (could possibly be adapted to be a riverstrider replacement if needed). A transport type creature - slow moving but big enough to fit a lot of ppl and/or stuff in. We already have Siltstriders so to have it on water seemed a better fit.

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:08 pm

By all means draw. Concept artists shouldn't worry themselves too much about implementation, and I'd like to see your idea.

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:54 am

Why don't we all try to show a little more fucking respect. I'm incredibly insulted, Myzel. You wouldn't get away with that if we weren't 5,000 miles apart.

Here's what's going to happen about Nerevar: someone's going to make a model that doesn't look like it was shat out by a turkey and then run through a meat grinder. That's just the truth. Maybe we'll see fit to put a nice ordinator sholderpad on him or something, but he's gonna look like a normal fucking bonewalker. We've had this conversation 50 fucking times and that's what's gonna happen.

So yeah, you can draw whatever the fuck you want to draw. But I've been assuming so far you want to be relevant to the project, which is why you're doing this here and not deviantart. So draw any fucking concept you want, but if it's not of Nerevar's undead head, you're just using garfield's bandwidth.

By all means, draw your fucking heart out.

brianbusby · Post by **brianbusby** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:41 pm

Hey I just saw we can post any Morrowind creature we can come up with so heres one I just did to match the reptilian theme found in the game.
[url=http://img710.imageshack.us/i/wildbeast.jpg/][img]http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/1504/wildbeast.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:31 pm

brianbusby wrote:I just saw we can post any Morrowind creature we can come up

It's always a good idea to read all of the thread.

I can see that your photoshop skills are improving

I like the look of this creature and while I don't see it as very fitting in regards to what we've already been exposed to in Morrowind due to the rather catlike look and very vibrant colour scheme - It could possibly be adapted to be a blackmarsh border creature with a bit of imagination.

Aspects of it leading me in a totally different direction though - its head looks almost fishlike. An aquatic version of it would be interesting to see.

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:01 pm

An interesting monster, but it doesn't really say 'morrowind' to me. Not really what we're looking for.

And yes, I did say at the beginning of the thread that you can draw any creature you can come up with. You can, obviously, but the chances it would be used are pretty slim. It would be more useful to focus on redesigns of our existing creatures and the few creature concepts that were requested in the course of the thread. That is what this thread was meant for.

brianbusby · Post by **brianbusby** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:38 pm

Myzel wrote: That is what this thread was meant for.

Oh okay, whatever, it was fun to draw anyway...Maybe I'll work on something else (but not st. neverar

)

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:27 pm

[url=http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nixbiped.png][img]http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/1389/nixbiped.th.png[/img][/url]

Lighter Than Some · Post by **Lighter Than Some** » Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:07 pm

[url=http://img168.imageshack.us/i/nixmountcopy.png/][img]http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/6329/nixmountcopy.th.png[/img][/url]

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Sat Feb 13, 2010 11:15 am

Very nice drawings. They both look interesting. Nix Chicken and Nix Dinosaur?

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:09 pm

Myzel wrote:Very nice drawings. They both look interesting. Nix Chicken...?

It's called a Chix, actually.

Lighter Than Some · Post by **Lighter Than Some** » Sat Feb 13, 2010 11:10 pm

Latest version of the Nix-mount

Thought if silt silt striders got big why not bump this one in size. Would be a completely domesticated species again like the strider. Too big to have a bunch of these guys wandering around unless they were extremely limited. I dub it the F'ral or F'ral-Hound.

Chix look tasty btw. Might need to balance it out or change the leg placement though. Or you could bulk up its back side. That would distribute the weight too. It looks like it's going to fall on its face all the time right now.

David House · Post by **David House** » Mon Feb 15, 2010 7:17 pm

Hey how does this look for the chix?

[url]http://img695.imageshack.us/i/chix02.png/[/url]
[url]http://img4.imageshack.us/i/chix03.png/[/url]
[url]http://img695.imageshack.us/i/chix02.png/[/url]

Havnt animated or even textured it yet, just wondering if theres anything I should change?

PS: is this lore correct? I love this thing

Nalin · Post by **Nalin** » Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:02 pm

*lols* The Chix was a joke DH.

I'm working on a sketch for a new creature atm though, a serious one.

David House · Post by **David House** » Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:21 pm

Cool!

Side note, does morrowind support bump map?

Edit: done texturing in mudbox, I got it at like 2.5k polys, if only morrowind could handle that ^.^

[url]http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/2241/splashu.png[/url]

if only if only...

Worsas · Post by **Worsas** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:57 am

As far as I can judge.. this looks fantastic!
Yes, Morrowind supports Bumb Maps. Therefore you need to attach an environment map in addition to the bumb map.

It's unusual though for Morrowind to have bumb mapped things. In order to stay consistent with the rest, you should maybe make a version without bumb mapping first and offer a bumb mapped version as an optional thing people can decide for on their own.

In order to imitate shaded areas you should use dark vertex painting and set the material-properties so that the vertex color is regarded as additional light source.

The polycount of about 2500 is perfectly fine, it can even be more. The creature itself looks very fitting.

Look if you can still add some detail either by adding some features to the mesh (eyes maybe), or detailing the texture... or both. I'm really looking forward to this one.

David House · Post by **David House** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 12:58 pm

I thought someone said not over 1k poly count, anyways, Ya I can add eyes and texture it better but, will this creature actually be used? I mean I don't believe its lore based, but ok, I've begun work on the eyes now.

PS: How do I change it so the brush counts as an additional light source?

Katze · Post by **Katze** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 1:07 pm

Something doesn't have to be explicitly mentioned in an in-game book to exist, you know.

If a creature seems appropriate to the world and environment, then it is "lore-friendly". I'm not entirely sure about the Chix as a Morowind creature myself, but I would still be very interested to see a more fitting texture put on it, perhaps.

Praedator · Post by **Praedator** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 1:42 pm

it has no eyes

Looks pretty nice though.

David House · Post by **David House** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:26 pm

Ok, now it has eyes, and I fixed it up a bit, only problem is now its saying its got like 6k polygons, which I know it doesn't because it looks (on the model side anyways) exactly the same. Anyways tweaked textures + eyes, tell me what yall think.

[url]http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/1540/test2u.png[/url]

still cant figure out how to make 3 objects be one object without useing the same texture, I might have to just make the models into one object and re-texture the hole thing :/ i'll keep yall updated if I find out a way around re-textureing it.

Edit: found out what was causing it to say it had 6k polys, that wasn't the polys that was the verts

also I have some good news and bad news, good news is I got the eyes and the body in one mesh with there individual textures, bad news is while I was testing this I noticed the texture for the face sucked, like REALLY bad, so im completely redoing the face.

Edit edit: bad news, importing the eyes killed the uv map, gonna havta redo the intire texture, texturing under progress.

Worsas · Post by **Worsas** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:36 pm

I thought someone said not over 1k poly count, anyways, Ya I can add eyes and texture it better but, will this creature actually be used? I mean I don't believe its lore based, but ok, I've begun work on the eyes now.

Creatures are a different thing. They in general have more geometry than static models. I'd estimate that everything up to 5000 faces is perfectly acceptable.

PS: How do I change it so the brush counts as an additional light source?

If you are using Blender, you need to check the "VColLight"-Button in the material window. I don't know what needs to be done in 3DS-max. Alternatively you might look after the material-properties in Nifskope where you may copy from any stock morrowind model.

In my opinion we should give this guy a chance.

David House · Post by **David House** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:55 pm

Worsas wrote:
I thought someone said not over 1k poly count, anyways, Ya I can add eyes and texture it better but, will this creature actually be used? I mean I don't believe its lore based, but ok, I've begun work on the eyes now.
Creatures are a different thing. They in general have more geometry than static models. I'd estimate that everything up to 5000 faces is perfectly acceptable.

PS: How do I change it so the brush counts as an additional light source?
If you are using Blender, you need to check the "VColLight"-Button in the material window. I don't know what needs to be done in 3DS-max. Alternatively you might look after the material-properties in Nifskope where you may copy from any stock morrowind model.

In my opinion we should give this guy a chance.

Ive been useing mudbox for all my textures, (blender allways seemed a bit clunky.) ill look up how to in mudbox/3ds max on the internet.

PS: offtopic: YAHOO modern warfare 2 just finished installing

Katze · Post by **Katze** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:58 pm

The texture looks a little bright and saturated for a Morrowind creature, and the legs probably need more detail, skin folds, crevices, especially at the joints.

It also looks like it might have trouble eating, so if you're serious about making this creature work, I'd advise giving it longer prehensile tentacles, or some form of flexible neck, and possibly a tail of some kind for balance.

Always nice to see new models being made, though. Keep at it!

David House · Post by **David House** » Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:10 pm

Im probably just going to tinker with it until Nalin draws something "serious"

Lighter Than Some · Post by **Lighter Than Some** » Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:46 am

lol(<- I know unproductive comment)

edit:

Morrowind swamp troll thing

[url=http://img199.imageshack.us/i/swamptrollcopy.png/][img]http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/7899/swamptrollcopy.th.png[/img][/url]

Idk on names yet. It's only a troll in idea I think was what was going on back on page one, not so much troll in style. Color I either want to go something stripy like a Brazilian Tapir or mottled, fitting the role of swamp gator.

David House · Post by **David House** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 2:35 am

Lighter Than Some wrote:lol(<- I know unproductive comment)

edit:

Morrowind swamp troll thing

[url=http://img199.imageshack.us/i/swamptrollcopy.png/][img]http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/7899/swamptrollcopy.th.png[/img][/url]

Idk on names yet. It's only a troll in idea I think was what was going on back on page one, not so much troll in style. Color I either want to go something stripy like a Brazilian Tapir or mottled, fitting the role of swamp gator.

Argh! I'm cut off from my computer at this time due to a sick brother, whenever the brother is removed from my room and I have access to my computer I'll get to work on this one, in the mean time, could you post a ref for the swamp gator, ive never heard of it, is it a tr creature? anyways, that and maybe a concept on how the texture should look, it will help me stay accurate when I start work, thanks!

Myzel · Post by **Myzel** » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:01 am

I have three things to say.

1. Please don't work on that creature. Lighter's troll looks really great, but unfortunately he got to the party a little late. Worsas has already modeled an outstanding troll for us that actually [url=http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g23/Worsas/creature05.jpg]looks pretty similar[/url]. Therefor, you modeling this troll and filling up our concept threads with it is very counterproductive. If you can't help yourself, do feel free to knock yourself out but keep it out of these threads.

2. I'd like all discussion regarding creatures to move over to the FCG now, so this thread can sink away into yesteryear. I will lock it now.

3. TR has no gators. I think Lighter meant an actual alligator.