Map 2 Detailing Area 9 [Swiftoak Woodwarrior] Discussion

Theo · Post by **Theo** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 10:04 am

Great work. I also recommend removing the shack parts (those shacks can be placed west to detailing claim 7) and lowering the main tower of the temple. It should be 1.5 heighth of the side towers, because it is an ideal proportion.

Chin Music · Post by **Chin Music** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:54 am

Looks gorgeous. I see you moved the Temple portion to be flush against the backwall and remove that awkward "back alley" section. Looks much nicer now. The front of the Temple also looks great.

Although yeah the Temple spire is completely and totally ridiculous. Needs to be way toned down.

As for the two statues facing each other like BC said, I also thought that looked a bit off, but thought it could be easily fixed by just turning them around. And like Hemitheon mentioned, the "top balcony" in front of the Temple with a planter base seems a little excessive.

Also as for the city on the whole, I neglected to mention this earlier but I think the dock piece that runs east/west that juts straight into the Foreign Quarter island right near the slums looks kind of strange.

Other than that, no complaints. Again, looks beautiful.

Post by **Haplo** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:15 pm

The shacks, actually, should stay for now.

The spire should be cut in half (just cut off the top half, that fire thing is stupid) and at least one of the three TR_ex_nec_h_09 on the central tower needs to be removed. In fact, remove two. Here's a screenshot of what I mean:

[url=http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/4972/templee.jpg][img]http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/4972/templee.th.jpg[/img][/url]

Also, you need to clean out a shady smuggler... he should not be sight seeing at the top of the Temple. -_-

I like what you did with lining the walk with trees, just be careful not to go too overboard, we redesigned Necrom and half of TR dating from pre-2005 because of things like that

MMMowSkwoz · Post by **MMMowSkwoz** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:14 pm

Swiftoak, don't forget to add the Gospels as per [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=268649&highlight=#268649]this post[/url].

Post by **Swiftoak** » Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:12 am

Agh. We should really retexture those domes (and the Moth and Fire).

Lady Nerevar · Post by **Lady Nerevar** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:27 pm

hey swifty, what do you still need in terms of meshes? im not sure if [url=http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?t=19940&sid=a86d3961057f519b2635f1eef4d7a98d]this claim[/url] is still valid or not.

Post by **Haplo** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 2:48 am

Just a heads-up, you're about a week away from the 1-month update time frame, Swiftoak.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:01 pm

That's cause there's not much left to update

I'm pretty much done Necrom. All I wait for now is some final fine detailing in the temple, as well as those retextured meshes.

Basically I just need to tweak the temple gardens to look good while keeping with lore.

Accompanying the final file will be a massive screenshot/blog update. The file will be re-merged into Area 9.

I'll also be providing Thrig with a list of new interiors that will have to be opened up with this claim.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:54 pm

Swiftoak Woodwarrior wrote:I'll also be providing Thrig with a list of new interiors that will have to be opened up with this claim.

Erhrm. Yet another person thinks I am the HoI. I am only making the narsis interiors at the moment (and can't even find time for those) How about you send them to nomadic, the ACTUAL HOI. (wtf people, 2 days in a row)

Post by **Swiftoak** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 6:02 pm

Thrignar Fraxix wrote: Erhrm. Yet another person thinks I am the HoI. I am only making the narsis interiors at the moment (and can't even find time for those) How about you send them to nomadic, the ACTUAL HOI. (wtf people, 2 days in a row)

Sorry...

Post by **Haplo** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 8:14 pm

You don't need to wait on the re-textured buildings, those will be updated automatically when they are added into TR_Data.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Mon Jul 06, 2009 11:52 pm

In that case then, it should be ready in a couple of DAYS.

Guaranteed, or you can revoke this by this time next week

As I said it's pretty much all in the fine details now, and sorting things out. As always some advice would be quite helpful. Most of the progress made has been in making a cemetery, fixing the temple as per Hap's suggestion (not exactly like what he showed, but close enough), and adding lights to the city (I think I may have overdone it in the temple, I want to see what you guys think.)

Here it is, version 0.7.

Tyrion · Post by **Tyrion** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:12 am

You could get away with using half the amount of lights. Unless it's a part of lore that Necrom is incredibly well lit, I think you could definitely tone down the lighting a bit.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:36 am

Ouch, yes. Also, I'd switch from the weird particle effect flame to the usual flames used everywhere else in the game, if I were you. It looks a bit 'out there' and 'moddy'.

You've also still got the hand-clap saints and the over-green grass. The grass at least could certainly do with toning down, as I mentioned in my previous post here.

Ooh, ooh. Also remember to use the new TR_furn_shrine_ord_01 (an activator) in as many places as is suitable. Replace some boring shrines with it, possibly the sexiest new item ever to come out of TR.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:46 pm

It's looking great! But as said: change the flames to regular flames, perhaps if the flame isn't too bright, it'd work anyway.

Do we have an interior for Necrom Temple at this stage?

Also, I suggest removing the two bits of spire between the spire base and point, so it doesn't look over the top (literally?)

Post by **Swiftoak** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 2:49 am

Aeven: I fixed the temple.

BC: Will do, but those lights will be a pain in the ass to replace

By the way I don't see the reference you are referring to under "Activator". Am I missing something?

Plus what texture for grass do you suggest me using?

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:41 am

You're still using an older version of TR_Data, or your last file certainly is.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:36 am

Re: the grass, I'd suggest sticking to the WG_rockyshrub for the Foreign Quarter.

Regarding Necrom proper, you just about could get away with it. But the contrast between the really verdant green grass and the bone-white buildings and the brown surroundings is quite unpleasant. It works (just) in the Temple district, where there's loads of the stuff, but in some of the other districts, you could try something a little more toned down, if it's possible. You're the exteriorer, not me!

Tyrion · Post by **Tyrion** » Sat Jul 11, 2009 4:09 pm

Remove about half the lights, don't just replace them all. I'm not sure if you're already doing this.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Tue Jul 14, 2009 5:13 pm

I just noticed a huge problem while playtesting this the other day:

TR_in_nec_ramp_02 is impossible to scale without levitation, even with an acrobatics of 100. It's too steep....

Someone should get to fixing this ASAP or most of Necrom's interiors will be off-limits.

ramp_01 seems to be fine though, should I go in and replace them, or should we fix the mesh?

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:07 pm

Someone should download the latest Data.

For me this problem was reported and fixed. More of an issue still is the TR_in_nec_wall piece which has bonkers collision.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 12:57 am

Ahh yes, Aeven reminded me of that detail, thanks again!

Anyways here is another update, v0.75. The final exterior will be 0.8, so yes it's very close now! This is probably the last update before I submit this.

I haven't made any of the light or grass fixes, but I worked up the Temple garden and Cemetery a little more. I just need to sprinkle some detail goodies in a few more planters, a couple containers in the docks, and the fixes mentioned and this should be out the door!

I'm sorry this has been taking forever as it shouldn't be.....

pacificmorrowind · Post by **pacificmorrowind** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:50 am

[quote="Bloodthirsty Crustacean"]Someone should download the latest Data. ;)

For me this problem was reported and fixed. More of an issue still is the TR_in_nec_wall piece which has bonkers collision.[/quote]

the collision on that ain't bonkers... it just doesn't exist. however seeing you're post I decided to go grab the file out of TRdata.bsa, and collision. Well it appears that morrowind's collision is more different from oblivion's than I thought... it took me a whole 15 minutes to understand the system.
So without further ado; here is a collisioned TR_in_nec_wall!
Pacific Morrowind

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 3:16 pm

You still haven't updated to the newest TR_Data

The spires of the temple look perfect now!

As I asked before; do we have an interior mesh for the temple? Possibly some work can be done by inverting the vertices and working from there.

Post by **Haplo** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:40 pm

No we don't have an interior for the Temple since it is not one static piece. Like has been mentioned numerous times before, it'll probably just be done using the existing tileset.

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:18 pm

pacificmorrowind wrote:the collision on that ain't bonkers... it just doesn't exist. however seeing you're post I decided to go grab the file out of TRdata.bsa, and collision. Well it appears that morrowind's collision is more different from oblivion's than I thought... it took me a whole 15 minutes to understand the system.
So without further ado; here is a collisioned TR_in_nec_wall!
Pacific Morrowind

Haha, actually, you've done the reverse. You have taken all the collision away from the wall again, where previously it used to think it was a massive cube (although there does appear to be a tiny amount at floor level).

If you could get this sorted with collision, that would be excellent!

Post by **Swiftoak** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 6:02 pm

Haplo wrote:No we don't have an interior for the Temple since it is not one static piece. Like has been mentioned numerous times before, it'll probably just be done using the existing tileset.

With something as grand as the temple, I would have expected a unique interior. I can work the exterior around it eh? The temple exterior (as I said before) isn't set in stone. I'd rather see a good interior done for it first, and work the outsides around it.

But it's your call, just saying

pacificmorrowind · Post by **pacificmorrowind** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 6:29 pm

[quote="Bloodthirsty Crustacean"][quote="pacificmorrowind"]the collision on that ain't bonkers... it just doesn't exist. however seeing you're post I decided to go grab the file out of TRdata.bsa, and collision. Well it appears that morrowind's collision is more different from oblivion's than I thought... it took me a whole 15 minutes to understand the system.
So without further ado; here is a collisioned TR_in_nec_wall!
Pacific Morrowind[/quote]

Haha, actually, you've done the reverse. You have taken all the collision away from the wall again, where previously it used to think it was a massive cube (although there does appear to be a tiny amount at floor level).

If you could get this sorted with collision, that would be excellent! :)[/quote]
okay it had no collision node so I guess if a static has no collision node it must just made a collision box around the whole thing. I must have misunderstood something in my nif pokings... I'll remake the collision tonight.
Pacific Morrowind
(sorry for posting offtopic on your thread Swiftoak)

pacificmorrowind · Post by **pacificmorrowind** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:00 am

Found what went wrong last time... for some unknown reason on export the collision field got moved 120 units behind the mesh!?! Once I figured out that it had done that it was easy to fix. So here it is, I guess BC you will get it into data? or should I pm/post it somewhere/to someone else?
Pacific Morrowind

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:39 am

Haplo wrote:No we don't have an interior for the Temple since it is not one static piece. Like has been mentioned numerous times before, it'll probably just be done using the existing tileset.

?

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:54 pm

The necrom tileset.

Aeven · Post by **Aeven** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:26 pm

I'd hate to see that be the case: the temple is far too unique to do that to it. Maybe two meshes: the big central temple, and the two addons. The big one would have three parts for the doors.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:42 pm

you forget what can be engineered by competent people. Also, our modelers have better things to do than make superfluous models

Sload · Post by **Sload** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:49 pm

I dare you TF. Unless my memory of the Necrom tileset is incredibly deficient, you're talking out for your monkey butt.

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 6:08 am

I'll plug in my flash drive and have a look, I was mostly talking out my ass and playing off my supreme confidence in our modders to do awesome things when needed. I'll edit this message to show my findings since for some reason I find it oh so important to make this post before checking rather than waiting. Also, you aren't on IRC and that makes me a sad admin.

Edit: Its 1:30 AM and I am tired as hell. This is what I came up with. Awesome things can be made with this tileset, I just meant this as a proof of concept. (You simply have to be able to pull off CS badassery) Fun fact: awesome things can be made with any tileset that has stack-able walls and the ability to place floors independent from ceilings. (hell, that just helps and isn't mandatory. Truly awesome people can do awesome things with anything)

I do want to say though that I had to Jerry-rig double tall pieces to do this. There would be more freedom if floor and ceiling pieces existed. (which would be a bit easier and faster to do then an interior piece, and would be usable should any other use of this tileset come up) Actually, I think there are exterior pieces that could serve the purpose of floors and ceilings... I closed my CS and I had messed up the movement settings before that anyway. My point stands, Necrom set is good for awesome things. (it also has nice integers to deal with when doing cool things, I love when pieces line up on actual numbers, and not decimals)

I hope this made sense, I will clarify as needed.

pacificmorrowind · Post by **pacificmorrowind** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 7:03 am

@@TF: though I am not yet promoted as a modeller (waiting for full review and most probably a little bit of editing and rereview of my model in showcase), want a ceiling and floor individual sections? ([s]if yes, what is the name of that tileset?, I'm horrible at remember names[/s] and then I look back a couple posts and see it is the necrom tileset so nvm on the name)
again sorry for clutting your thread with OT stuff Swiftoak
Pacific Morrowind

Bloodthirsty Crustacean · Fri Jul 17, 2009 10:49 am

Pacific, your previous mesh was perfect.

Either Haplo will see this and put it in Data, or you should PM him.

TF, while your 'ledge' thing is interesting, I don't know that stuff like that alone is enough to make something like the Temple? I think we'd really need some kind of set up like the Mournhold Temple's to do it true justice (i.e. a unique interior piece or two, backed up by the normal set). But hey, if someone can pull off some kind of Cire-like act of genius with the tileset, I'm happy.

Post by **Swiftoak** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 4:41 pm

I gotta go with Sload on this one.

The Necrom temple seems more organic than the existing tileset could ever do (straight lines, etc). I know that a good interior modder will be able to do something. It's just that I think it merits a few extra statics. I know it will take extra time (and considering I'm not a modeller I shouldn't be the one saying anything) but what can we lose right?

I like what you did there though, it could be useful for catacombs. The angles look funny though, but I know you were tired and whatnot.

edit: By the way, we should get some shrine activators done. Like several with the same mesh as the Shrine of Nerevar, except activators.

I also suggest adding some new meshes for statues because they're lacking right now, and I have some good ideas for them

Thrignar Fraxix · Post by **Thrignar Fraxix** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 7:40 pm

the slope was simply to demonstrate that curves and custom balconies are possible. It was the best I could do at 1:30 AM

Post by **Haplo** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:11 am

I'm this close to making a thread and giving everyone 1 hour to post everything they ever want included in TR_Data before I close it forever:

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