Imperial Armor - Hammerfell Flavour

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Imperial Armor - Hammerfell Flavour

Post by Anonymous »

As you know, the imperial armor seems to change from game to game. There is an easily explicable reason for this: rather than there being a universal uniform, equipment is specifically designed for a campaign. This is most obviously demonstrated in "the armorer's challenge", where two armorers compete to get the contract to design the armor for the Black Marsh Campaign:

http://til.gamingsource.net/mwbooks/armchallenge.shtml

There is obvious logic in designing new armor for each campaign. Obviously, something you would wear in Skyrim would be downright dangerous to wear in Black Marsh, and vice versa. There seem to be some common themes, such as the obvious draw from Ancient Roman styles. Another common theme are the ranks of black, silver and gold. If you remember, the normal imperial cuirass in morrowind was black with steel bits.

To cut to the chase, I think we should make a variant on the Imperial armor for Hammerfell, and this seemed the best place to ask. This is what it looked like in the game Redguard:

http://redguard.bethsoft.com/images/profile/attrebus1.gif
http://redguard.bethsoft.com/images/profile/attrebus2.gif
http://til.gamingsource.net/tsorg/part01image01.jpg (along bottom)
http://til.gamingsource.net/tsorg/part01image21.jpg
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h273/strosmkai/RF2.png

Now, bear in mind this was 400 years ago so its likely the armor will have changed slightly. Also this is Stros M'Kai, and its entirely possible that they had a differnet one for around the desert.

So, any thoughts on armor design?
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Orix
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Post by Orix »

They have a system of colouration in Oblivion too.

The normal Imperial Guards wear very simple, dull iron armour, whereas Imperial Palace guards have very detailed white armour, they dont have a templar armour, but the knight of the imperial dragon armour is black.

All generic towns guards wear the same armour, although the cheif usually lacks a helmet, same with high ranking imperial guards I think.

That armour for Redguard is quite cool. Although to me it doesn;t make sense to be wearing black armor in what will be a rather hot environment.

The concealing nature of the amrour kind of makes sense, it traps moisture, so the guards need less water intake, although on the down side, it would be very uncomfortable in hot weather, at the end of the day the armour would be like wearing a second skin, so perhaps a more airy design?

All of that said, there have been quite a number of armour concepts already Jale, have you looked through the concepts thread? A few are displayed on this site: [url]http://mods.moddb.com/7086/tamriel-rebuilt/image-gallery/[/url]
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Post by Anonymous »

I dont remember seeing any imperial armor around, but if anyone could dig it out and stick it here, that would be great. I know that someone is planning on modding in a (legally remade) version of the Morrowind Imperial armors ASAP.

It isnt clever to be wearing black leather, but also it isnt very clever to be wearing armor either. They would probably need extra endurance training to serve in Hammerfell.

I think we should stick to the black/silver/gold formula, since Oblivion could be explained away by saying 'oh well thats at home, so they have no need to make it obvious who's who.
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Post by Orix »

I disagree, I dont think they'd keep to that system of armour colouration across all provinces, especially in this case when wearing armour would be like sitting in a frying pan. Also, Morrowind armours are nice, but you were saying that each campaign should be different :?.

I think this was an Imperial Armour concept based on that in Redguard: http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/files/hammerfellarmor_821.jpg

If you search for "armor" or "amour" (depending on how people have spelt it) you'll come across a lot in the concept art thread. I think some organization needs to be done of arms , armour, clothes and creatures for Hammerfell. Like single threads filled with all the concepts made/approved thus far.

I would do it myself, since I'm quite adept at gathering and displaying materials, but I just dont have the time to waste with all my exams.
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Post by Sload »

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v86/stanley/CyrodiilGuards.jpg
In order of left to right, Top: Bravil, Anvil, Chorrol. Middle: Bruma, Cheydinhal, Skingrad, Leyawiin. Bottom: High Ranking Legion, Low Ranking Legion

As you can see, there are two basic armors for guards, the city guard armor and the legion armor.

The legion also guards the Imperial City. The legion would rarely be seen in Hammerfell, them being recalled to Morrowind, but their armor should stay the same, mainly because it means less work for our modellers who have quite a work load as it is and a slightly smaller file for download.

The city guard armor should work the same way in Hammerfell. They would have the same basic look with some retexture or otherwise minor difference to make them unique. I would imagine that the black would be Stros M'kai's unique guard armor.
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Post by Macar »

That picture is missing Kvatch :)
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Post by Sload »

That's because it was hidden with an EditorID starting with MQ for Mainquest. It's got a fox and it's gray, but it isn't the Gray Fox.
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Post by Macar »

I know, my character wore it! But I thought it was a wolf and it looked white to me.
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Post by Gez »

Dang, Sirollus Saccus is more than three hundred year-old?

Remember that in Morrowind, there were three standard Imperial armor sets (steel, templar, and chain) plus several cuirasses (leather, newtscale, dragonscale).

Attrebus illustrates a kind of leather armor, which seems a good idea for the legion on an island -- you don't want metal armor, even "light" like chainmail, when there's a risk to fall from a boat.

Oblivion has less variety, with guard armor and legion armor. There's more individual cuirasses, but less materials used. No chainmail, no leather. No scales.

Something looking a bit like a mix between Morrowind's imperial leather armor and Attrebus' leather armor would be nice for Stirk.
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Post by Anonymous »

I do think that wearing chain in Hammerfell sun would be pretty suicidal for a soft Imperial. While the shapes and motifs should remain, I think we should thing more towards 'light' armor than chainmail.

The black wasn't Stros M'kai unique because people talkinga bout them would just refer to them as 'black ranked' or words to that effect. I think more the red trim and the use of the Imperial Dragon motif would be the Stros M'kai armor, at least in the time of Imperial Occupation. Today they might have developed a new one, or even adopted the old symbol of Stros M'Kai in an attempt to placate the crowns: a fist, surrounded by three crowns. This could be easily imperialised replacing the crowns with light, as thats what the crowns looked like.

I found some more good pics:
http://til.gamingsource.net/tsorg/part12image35.jpg
http://til.gamingsource.net/intros/rg_intro_06.jpg

Note that although the previous images were attributed to a specific soldier, Attrebius, it was just the normal guard armor. The golden armor does indeed encorporate more metal, and I think the silver one is a sorta interim version, with a bit more steel/silver than the more leathery black armor.

Also the helmets seem to almost match the normal guard helmets of oblivion, though the golden ones are pretty much like the silver helm of Morrowind. I cant remember what the actual Redguard silver helm looks like.
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Post by Sload »

That armor should be ignored. The latest picture posted clearly says that these soldiers are of Tiber Septim's army, which is the Legion. Therefore, this is just an old design of Legion armor and we can do whatever we like.
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Post by Anonymous »

True, but these were the army used to invade hammerfell, suggesting that was the design they went for.

And, since some of the designs (like the shape of the helmet..silver helm from morrowind) are the same, it could make sense to at least base it on that.

Just to justify the thing about Stros M'kai's guards having the dragon as their callsign...it was the Imperial capital of administration at that time, and there was a red dragon under the palace.
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Post by Anonymous »

Bit of a bump and a double post, but I went into redguard and pulled this:

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v149/Dark_Jale/StrosmkaiEmblem.jpg[/img]

Im fairly sure they intended this to be the emblem of Stros M'Kai. Its pretty assertive, there are crowns on it to show their allegiance, its surrounded by the crowns showing their island way (bearing in mind they are sorta on a peninsula in the town) and it really is on every major building in the town. It crops up on all the gates, and even on the 'old town' area which suggests that this image has been associated with the island for a long long time. No reason to suggest that it would have changed, I think, and I think its a pretty cool little emblem. Morgoth is working on a better image of it.
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Post by Nichevo »

Jale wrote:I do think that wearing chain in Hammerfell sun would be pretty suicidal for a soft Imperial. While the shapes and motifs should remain, I think we should thing more towards 'light' armor than chainmail.
Hey, they're not that heavy! Very flexible and quite easy on the body (I spent three whole days with one :) )
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Post by Morgoth »

I extracted these from that picture as a favor for Jale:

[img]http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/2264/emblemjale6wn.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/4764/emblemjale27cq.jpg[/img]
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Post by Gnomey »

But Imperials wouldn't want three crowns, they would want one, the Emporer. Is there anything that can replace the crowns on each side?
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Post by Anonymous »

The imperials don't have anything to do with this, its the symbol of Stros M'Kai, a crown power who 'aint gonna let nobody fuck with' their emblem. They didnt change it when they had totalitarian power 400 years ago, and they have less influence over the goings on of the place now. Besides, the three crowns dont really represent anything, except maybe the water on three sides of the town.
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Post by Gez »

On the screenshot, it seems more circular than what you've made, Morgoth. The three crowns make a broken ring, not a broken ovoid. Like this:
[url=http://imageshack.us][img]http://img446.imageshack.us/img446/3015/emblemjale5we.jpg[/img][/url]


Hehe, I'm asking someone with the screenname Morgoth to make something more like a broken ring. :)
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Post by Gnomey »

Oh, right, Stros M'kai would only have one king anyway, if it were independant. You are right. :D I thought you had been discussing putting it on the legions, which you probably did as the legions are the subject of this thread. But now, even if you do that, I'll be quite fine with it. :D
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