The Blood Hand Guild

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:15 am

Only for the worst of criminals (and vamps). Must have a bounty of at least 6000 to even join.

This (just like the spell books) is a clan for those who can't or won't do bussiness with normal people. These people could be located throughout VF and Tamriel here and there to offer services ONLY to members of the Blood Hand guild.

I'm not sure how the rank ratios will work but I think that rank should be determined by stats(as normal) as well as bounty increase and of course duties. Perhaps an example of a duty would be to disrupt another guild or even kill a certain number of Redoran Guards.

Ranks: (ideas) help me out with these plz.
1. Bum
2. Drifter
3. Street Thug
4. Bully
5. Criminal
6. Entrepeneur
7. Crime Lord
8. Politician
9. Guild Commander
10. Guild Master

And hey, if you think this a good idea then check out the "Bounty Hunters" post in Custom Ideas.

Aaricus · Post by **Aaricus** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:24 am

I like the idea Enlil, i really like the idea of having a bounty of at least 6,000. Maybe... In order to join them you have to defeat a group of goons the guild itself sends on you, in order to prove your worthyness... I hear its a common thing in real life when people want to join a gang

Nomadic1 · Post by **Nomadic1** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 8:28 am

Hey, sweet idea. FInally something good for being the most vile thing in the east. 8)

Psyborg · Post by **Psyborg** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 1:53 pm

It gets my vote, for all it's worth...
What would happen if your bounty dropped BELOW 6000 glorious septims? Would you be kicked out? Mocked for being a sellout? KILLED?

Or whatever.

BalinMinister · Post by **BalinMinister** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 2:42 pm

Eh...not to be a party pooper but the sample tasks that you mentioned wont fly too well becuase, for example, what if someone is part of House Redoran?

Making a criminal orginazation is difficult because it simply has to involve targets that will not affect someone's guild status...meaning lay noblemen and petty commoners are the only targets of possible merit...however that can be turned into great fun as well

Im for it, though, because i think the option is a good one for players

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 2:59 pm

question 1. Something bad would happen an assination attempt every few weeks until u get ur bounty back up or kill the guild master.

question 2. Perhaps the Redoran guards were a bad example. We could always make the targets less popular and intrusive. Then again we also have to remember that a player who is role playing a theif and a murderer probablly doesn't care too much about being in many other clans or dealing with normal people in general. Also, in the morag tong guild you can kill people that are not normally accessible ( as far as ruining your game). So that could be part of it; if your high enough rank then most people just leave you alone about your misdoings. Like politicians. Or at least you'd get away with it.

Assassinace · Post by **Assassinace** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 7:14 pm

I don't know if you've played daggerfall but the Dark Brotherhood works almost exactly in this way. (Thieves guild as well in Daggerfall).
Basically I'm not sure there is room for a faction like this in Morrowind unless you make it localized to 1 or 2 cities.

Spider · Post by **Spider** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 7:33 pm

I voted 'YES' because this is a good idea, but realistically this wouldn't work. The whole manner in how the criminal and reputation system works everyone knows just what you've been up to, whether you've been naughty or nice. An organization as large as a guild or faction wouldn't be able to exist being comprised of a bunch of bodies with a bounty of 6,000 septims or more. Such easily spotted bad guys would never be able to gain/maintain the level of organisation and resources required fot their operation. If this was 'the worst of the worst' the outfit would also only last as long as someone from within didn't try to take over or cash in on all those lovely bounties and retire.

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 8:04 pm

Non of the NPCs would have the high bounty. The NPC population of the guild would simply refuse their services to the player unless s/he belonged to the guild.
As far as having the capability to maintain the organization, crime lords do it all over the US and all across the world.

I have never had the chance to play Daggerfall. If this was true in that game then I would agree with you. However these guilds do not seem entirely like that in Morrowind. I'm speaking of a clan that is throughout Morrowind and is full ruthless people that can offer all the same services as the normal populous of the world.
I am of the opinion that the criminal player should have at least the chance for enchanting items and buying weapons without the threat of being attacked shunned.
This, of course would be a much harder way of life. And I would say that to go up in ranks, the player would have to kill the "rank holder". One rank holder for each rank at all times. Sometimes the lower rank holders come after the player.
I would also propose that since the player has opted to be a criminal, his/her punishment should be the above as well as the rank holders being at least 10 levels higher and well equipped.

Also if you are to read my post on bounty hunters in the "Custom Ideas",this may seem to balance out.

Here's what I'm going to do.

Leave the vote for a while and see what the forum thinks. Then I will reconsider making it. Even if I do make it, it doesn't mean that it's going in the game. So I guess we'll just see huh?

Assassinace · Post by **Assassinace** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 8:09 pm

In daggerfall if you killed a certain amount of people (3 or 8 or something) you would be asked to join the Dark Brotherhood (Also called the assassins guild).
If you pickpocketed a certain amount of people, can't remember how many, it worked even if you pickpocketed rats (don't ask :p), you would be asked to join the thieves guild.
As far as crime syndacites go there are already a ton in morrowind. (Morag Tong, Thieves Guild, Commona Tong, Wharf Rats, Even a little of the Dark brotherhood). Not to mention the various houses shady dealings and corrupt imperials. Therefore I think Morrowind itself is corrupt enough. That is not to say that this idea wouldn't fit in elsewhere.

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:20 am

Do I need to add this to NPCs or do I just post it with the clan info and the required scripts in a plug-in?

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Sat Aug 07, 2004 3:20 am

Can ne 1 help me with this question plz?

Gooblecakes · Post by **Gooblecakes** » Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:16 pm

BalinMinister wrote:...Making a criminal orginazation is difficult because it simply has to involve targets that will not affect someone's guild status...

no, thats just stupid to say that you have to make it compatible with every faction. I think we should make it have conflicts to increase replay value, roleplaying, and realism. think about, in reall life there is no way your gonna join a street gang, the mafia, and the police force and expect your reputasion to be good with all of them.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:39 pm

Gooble has a point... If being a part of this organisation is like being a vampire in that you can never go back to normal life then I have no problems with it.

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:46 am

That replay value thing is pretty cool. Well if anyone is interested in helping me build this thing let me know. I'm kinda clueless as far what I need to build to make it ready for review. Do I build all the npc's all the interiors and all the quests as well as the faction itself or some of these things or none or what? Any light would be appreciated as well as anyone who wants to help with the project. As far as it not being accepted, I think that is what the review board is for and I will leave that to them. I'm just gonna build...they can chew it up; that's their job. So anyone interested let me know.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:30 pm

Would be neat if when you got high enough rank in the guild, guards wouldn't attack you in groups less than 5 or 6 because they're afraid of you

And maybe special groups of guards would be sent out to try to kill you. Stuff like that. Real notorious criminal stuff rather than every guard you run into trying take you out on his or her own. You don't see single police men trying to take down mob bosses, so why should single guards try to take out a high ranking member of an organised crime group?

I always thought Morrowind lacked much gameplay beyond slaughtering guards once you truely went the path of the bad guy. I think this guild, done properly, could open up more for those who want to be blatently evil. In fact, I think a few more blatently evil factions should be added as well, currently Morrowind in general mostly caters to the good guys.

Edit: Or even, have some higher level quests to pay off prominent politicians and guard factions so that they'll turn a blind eye to the guild's activities

Just like a real crime organisation.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 7:33 pm

Enlil, this is a great idea, since i have 625678 bounty, i can be a guild master

Just kidding, but seriously, this is great idea....
Don't let it be forgotten....

P.S. and perhaps you can help me with something...
My idea is Order of Dusk and Dawn

shadowmoon · Post by **shadowmoon** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 8:30 pm

i voted yes as this order is feasible (sp?) unlike certain unmentioned daedra vampire outcast banding (^^^)

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Oct 15, 2004 9:43 pm

Gooblecakes wrote:
BalinMinister wrote:...Making a criminal orginazation is difficult because it simply has to involve targets that will not affect someone's guild status...
no, thats just stupid to say that you have to make it compatible with every faction. I think we should make it have conflicts to increase replay value, roleplaying, and realism. think about, in reall life there is no way your gonna join a street gang, the mafia, and the police force and expect your reputasion to be good with all of them.

Broode wrote:Gooble has a point... If being a part of this organisation is like being a vampire in that you can never go back to normal life then I have no problems with it.

Broode, not only does he have a point, but Thieves Guild folks steal from people from almost every faction, and Fighters Guild folks killed some Thieves Guild toads too...
And, the leaders of the factions are always yammering about your high crime rating, so, I'd say; SHED THEIR BLOOD!

Btw, You guys digging the Theme-song?It really fits in while browsing

Psyborg · Post by **Psyborg** » Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:35 pm

Btw, You guys digging the Theme-song?It really fits in while browsing

You do that too? I thought I was just strange...

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:18 am

Really, i dont listen to it when im not browsing this place, but it just isnt right without it...
Now, lets end this, after all, this discussion has a topic

Hermit · Post by **Hermit** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 1:39 am

I voted no, because this is not quite original an idea. We have already two (three if you count the Dark Brotherhood, and four if you cound the legitimate Morag Tong) assassination/criminal guilds in Morrowind. How many criminals can a society sustain? Certainly not yet another cartel.

Besides, how many 6000+ criminals are there in Tamriel? Likely, not more than a handful. That's supposed to make a guild? Not to even mention, what do they live of? What are their missions, what are their backgrounds, what will the guild's main quest be?

This sounds a lot like some adolescent gangsta fantasy. And I don't precisely like these. This is Tamriel Rebuilt, not GTA goes Morrowind.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 2:02 am

i vote no. sry, but we already have a criminal guild that has been aproved and all, and that is the Camonna Tong Bolt On which i'm directing. besides, its one thing making an unjoinable guild joinable, but i agree that there are way to many criminal guilds in morrowind. perhaps in some other province were we don't have all the lore. and we can fiddle around with it. but definatly not on morrowind. i had trouble getting the Camonna Tong up and running, and this will be even harder considering there is no lore backbone and the idea is a bit odd. it IS a nice idea, but not in Tamriel rebuilt. especially not in morrowind. but u should hold on to the idea. it may not become a faction but it may become a great quest. but not in morrowind.

FatalChaos · Post by **FatalChaos** » Tue Nov 02, 2004 1:00 am

I voted yes, but i think this should be more of a thug based guild. Not a sneaky thieve/assasin guild. Like thier missions would be to fight other gangs, or to get a few gang members and use brute force to kill someone. Maybe even loot a house.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 9:01 pm

I vote for revival of the Blood Hand Guild. The questions that have arrisen with this guild, I feel, have been answered to logical satisfaction. I propse that this not be an assassination guild like the Tongs but rather a low-end street-gang sort of guild built by, and joinable for low-end criminals.

Graff · Post by **Graff** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:19 am

I vote no, sorry dude. As a set of misc quests, this might be a good idea, but why would a bunch of criminals with no common goal (Cammona Tong had a goal, to rid VF of outlanders, Thieves Guild, had a goal, to make profit) hang around together for the sake of it?

Graff.

Nomadic1 · Post by **Nomadic1** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:17 am

The Cammona Tong was a mafia. Getting rid of outlanders was their second, third, fourth, fifthg or even lower priority.

It could work if it was given a Dunmerish name and organised like a thuggish mafia like the Camonna Tong was. Or if there was an important reason for them being organised as such. As just a thuggish bums' organisation, I don't think it will be believable as an organised guild.

Graff · Post by **Graff** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:20 am

But what's the point of having two mafias in the same province, if we need an organised crime guild, we have the Thieves guild or Cammona tong, the point I'm trying to make is that a less formal organised crime group might be used, but there's no reason to have it as an official guild.

Graff.

Nomadic1 · Post by **Nomadic1** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:43 am

Yes, but the Camonna Tong is limited exclusively to Vvardenfell. Poeple here intend to stretch their operations through Hlaalu lands to Narsis (which is reasonable enough). It does leave a gap for a local crime syndicate of any kind though on the mainland. It would probably be limited to Map 3 & 6 because the Redoran and Telvanni are unlikely to allow it to exist.

Theo · Post by **Theo** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 12:46 pm

*Sighs* Time to start some cleanup of this forum.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Oct 14, 2005 5:30 pm

lol..ok I get it. I like the idea but it has obvious issues with many of out TR members, so in the spirit of teamwork and progress I propose that this guild be disapproved and scrapped. *sobs* Goodbye Blood Hand Guild.

Enlil · Post by **Enlil** » Sun May 18, 2008 4:34 am

It was a good idea...and long dead. I think I will build a plugin with the guild just the same and put it out there.

Tamriel Rebuilt

The Blood Hand Guild

Is this a good idea?

The Blood Hand Guild

Oh well...