While observing TR map, I've found some strange moments and questioned them on Discord. Rotouns answered me.
But I don't want these moments to be seen by only one man, so I'm copying here our conversation for someone else to read - because, I think, these parts of TR can be improved.
The map I was observing
Overpopulation in Telvanni
TL;DR: Telvanni have too much of them while Redoran and Hlaalu having almost none and Dres having literally zero.
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Abandoned forts
TL;DR: they are only in Indoril lands.
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Two Cephorad Keeps
TL;DR: what's on the oceanic coast southeast of Bosmora and not done yet?
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TL;DR: Great House Dres is too microscopic.
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Nythrend
TL;DR: Western Aanthirin ones must have Redoran & Indoril buildings, it would improve TR suprisingly greatly.
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My explanation of importance of having Redoran & Indoril buildings in western Aanthirin
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Rotouns' answer
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When I was finishing this message, Kevaar started to answer me on Discord. Thanks to her too!)
What are you thinking about the problems I've found?
2016-01-19 19:35
1 month 3 weeks ago
One thing to keep in mind is that these lands are still in active development, and so may see more population being added as time goes on.
Telvanni
Unfortunately, any changes to Telvanni regions have been put off until the rest of the mod is finished, or else we'll waste manpower and eat our own tail over content that is "good enough". That said, the idea was that the Empire wanted to make a curtain wall of forts along the eastern side of Tamriel to protect from sea invaders. Telvanni barely noticed/didn't care.
Indoril forts: I would make a hesitant suggestion to say the unmanned forts in the Indoril areas are remnants from the war with the Empire, or else were left over when the Empire wanted to make sure Morrowind was cowed. Nevermind the ESO stupidity; Vvardenfell is a frontier which is why there are a substantial number of forts there, and shouldn't be taken as the norm.
Two Cepharods: simple explanation. The old one is being deleted and moved to the new one's place.
Dres settlements: these will likely see expansion as we develop their lore a little more, but keep in mind too that the Deshaan Plains and the borders to Black Marsh are very harsh environments, like the Ashlands. Big populations wouldn't make sense here.
Hlaalu settlements: I see the lore logic behind this, but I am hesitant what this might look like in practice--perhaps one of the larger buildings in some of these settlements could be the old style, representing how Hlaalu came in and then built up around whatever village they had taken over (I assume we are ignoring ESO's stupidity that Hlaalu were builders that just happened to build Redoran's Suran in the Hlaalu style for the sake of some weird power-struggly nonsense--though there may be an argument to be made that the square-shaped Hlaalu "is" Redoran style, before (or after) Redoran mixed culture with the Ashlanders, including "modernizing" bug-shell Ashlander architecture). Also, Velothi cliff-dwellings are due to be placed in Roth Roryn, which is currently Hlaalu controlled and would represent the old holdings of Indoril and Velothi.
2017-12-12 18:37
7 years 1 week ago
Kevaar, aren't Telvanni wizards strong enough to defend themselves?
Also, half of the settlements (
Cephorad, Helnim, Windmoth) are placed direclty near Telvanni towers. Would they really "barely notice" that?Why only Indoril lands do have abandined forts?
What do you think of, for example, cutting Andothren into two districts? One would be old and Redoran, another - new, Hlaalu one. This city is already separated into two halfs.
2015-09-28 20:13
2 years 8 months ago
As I've talked about on Discord, the Hlaalu settlements are by now Hlaalu settlements, with no old core remaining. The conquest was 400 years ago, not 4, and they simply reused the building materials instead to build their settlements over the years instead of keeping the old buildings in shape. If there was a settlement just taken over by the Hlaalu within the last decades then yes, I could see it. Settlements from four centuries ago? No.
There's also no way that we're going to throw half of Andothren out and redo it. it's too much work.
There are Indoril ruins in the west, just no on my map yet. As said, I simply haven't gotten around to hunt for them, but there definitely are some in non-Indoril lands.
Helnim is a settlement that is half Imperial because the wizard lord was asleep (or insane) at the helm so there was an opportunity. It's fairly unique in that regard. Bal Oyra has been considered to be on the chopping block for a good long while, Cephorad Keep since recently (moving south) and the other Imperial settlements are Firewatch, and two legion forts which hold major infrastructure choke points (which are the aforenamed curtain wall). None of the changes in TR_Mainland will happen anytime soon.
2017-12-12 18:37
7 years 1 week ago
About Imperial forts - there will be 3 instead of 5, and Indoril will have 2 running + 3 abandoned + OE, but:
2015-08-10 20:50
3 weeks 6 days ago
Lots to reply to here.
I would be very surprised if any significant thought went into the distribution and number of Imperial forts in TR_Mainland. Once upon a time, the idea was probably to have Imperial forts near all major settlements as on Vvardenfell, which is a dreadful idea already, but even that doesn't explain the dense Imperial presence in Telvannis.
Here's what I'd do with Telvannis, and what I understand to essentially be the basic plan, insofar as we have one, seeing as implimentation is very far off: Helnim becomes an Imperial charter town like Caldera, of a minor trade company. Bal Oyra could be cut, though I personally have no issue with it. Firewatch could perhaps be made more compact in design, but certainly stays. Cephorad Keep is moved southwards, and for the rest the concept is that the forts are part of an old coastal defence against Akavir, a plan which was eventually abandoned due to lack of support/hostility of the locals. (It was too hard to keep the forts supplied). Even those that are still running are barely scraping by.
The current Imperial attitude to a possible invasion from Akavir as that the Telvanni/Indoril/Argonian ingrates can take the brunt of the invasion and try to fend them off their way, and if they Akaviri get past the hostile east, more easily supplied and supported Imperial fortifications, including Old Ebonheart, would be waiting for them.
Lutemoth fort is eventually getting removed from next to Almalexia as well; Umbermoth, as part of the coastal defence, will be the only active fort. The abandoned forts, again, probably had no broad planning behind them, folks working on those lands just happened to like the idea of ruined Imperial forts. The ones in the east can serve as remnants of the coastal defence, but the one in Inlet Bog I have no idea on.
Telvanni are not really aggressively hostile to outsiders, or not predictably so. They rarely care about what goes on outside of their towers. Dres are different; they are fiercely and consistently territorial, and do not give an inch. As a result, most everyone leaves them alone, Empire included.
The Dres population is intentionally small; they would just be a gaggle of poor tribes, much like the Ashlanders, if they didn't borrow power far beyond their means. It is true that, having gotten power beyond their means, and as a result controlling massive nubmers of slaves and producing massive amounts of saltrice, one might expect their population to explode, but I don't think most people will thik that far, and I think the Dres work better this way; they would be way too overwhelming if they also had a huge population.
I do think Redoran should probably get more Imperial presence of some description, though that requires some more thought and planning. Hlaalu would not have more Imperial towns and forts, because their cities are more open to outlanders and the Empire, and (unlike on Vvardenfell) the Empire maintains garrisons within the Hlaalu cities, in Hlaalu buildings.
As Atray said, Hlaalu gained the Redoran and Indoril lands about 400 years before when the game is set. As Redoran buildings are made of organic materials like adobe and plaster, they will have deteriorated in that time. That said, the Redoran do have minor holdings on Lake Coronati, and I was planning to try out some Redoran ruins for those holdings (which would be more recent). Indoril architecture is more lasting, hence the Indoril ruins, though the OM set has no shortage of issues. But for the rest, tileset usage in-game is purely convention; just as the ancient cities in Skyrim have a completely consistent design across all their buildings despite their complex history, TR cities are assigned tilesets based on faction affiliation, which keeps things simple and avoids ugly style mixing.
In short, the Hlaalu did not deliberately tear down existing structures, but either due to the flow of time or convention, few signs of them remain.